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With Mesa coming along rather nicely in the latest releases, Feral Interactive are requesting that Canonical push out Mesa updates to their official graphics driver PPA to help Feral officially support Mesa in their Linux ports.

Edwin, FeralWe have been working with the Mesa community to help improve the Mesa drivers so more games can run on AMD and Intel hardware, and in the last year this has started to hit the tipping point and support has become more and more viable when using the very latest drivers.

Part of the problem is that Mesa on Ubuntu is often outdated, meaning if Feral (and other game developers) want to give support for it, there needs to be an easy and tested way to get the latest open source GPU drivers.
Edwin, FeralThe biggest issue we have is there is no way for a user to officially download and install the latest stable versions of Mesa. For example because the official Mesa 13.0.1 release isn’t available to install on Ubuntu, you need to compile it yourself.

Adding tested packages to the official PPA would be an ideal solution for now:
Edwin, FeralI’d like to suggest that official Mesa releases are also added to the graphics-drivers PPA using the release information on the mesa.org website: http://www.mesa3d.org/relnotes.html

You can see the full mailing list entry here.

Hopefully this will get sorted, so users on AMD and Intel can get the best gaming experience possible on Ubuntu.

Not everyone is comfortable compiling things, and I agree that users shouldn't be required to go and compile graphics drivers to get stable versions of Mesa. While there are other PPA's around, they usually provide packages from git which can come with all sorts of breakage. This could benefit a lot of people.

Additional note: The less PPA's people have to add, the more secure they may be. It was an issue raised in our IRC that people flock to all sorts of random PPA's (guilty!), so having a trusted one for this would be awesome. Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
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liamdawe 18 November 2016 at 7:33 pm UTC
orochikyoI did post something related to this in another thread here, and now Feral is saying what we most of us already know: If updating software and drivers become easier, without the need of going to the terminal, adding a new repository and installing software from there, or waiting for a new version of the distro to be released, it would make Linux a much more friendly platform.
Not only compiling stuff is annoying but the fact that going to the terminal scares a lot of potential users who want to get away from Windows. Mayor linux distributions needs a driver update center away from synaptic or app manager, so driver devs can post there the lastest stable drivers and then the user will be asked if he wants to update...
I agree, fully. The annoying thing is I usually get ridiculed when people find out how little I know about the terminal. It's part of the old attitudes we have to break through, to get it into people's minds. You shouldn't have to learn terminal to be able to use Linux.

It's not as bad as it used to be, we have way more tools exposed via a decent UI than we did 2-3 years ago. The situation has slowly improved for sure, but this is certainly something that should be handled better.
wojtek88 18 November 2016 at 7:43 pm UTC
Sorry for little off-topic but did any of you visit Feral's radar today? I ask because there is no Total War: Warhammer which is weird.
What's more they have only 2 titles in radar. Either they are going to fill the radar with something huge or they have nothing big prepared for next months...


Last edited by wojtek88 at 18 November 2016 at 7:43 pm UTC
TobiSGD 18 November 2016 at 8:00 pm UTC
Maybe it would also be worth thinking about the fact that Ubuntu, while probably the largest distribution, isn't the whole ecosystem. If Ubuntu just doesn't do it for them, why not recommend a distribution that is updated more often by default? Fedora usually has pretty up to date packages and is somewhat consumer oriented (I think promoting something like Arch, which I personally use, or Gentoo might just not fly with consumer oriented business), or maybe a rolling release distro like PCLinuxOS.
ElectricPrism 18 November 2016 at 9:55 pm UTC
liamdawe
orochikyoI did post something related to this in another thread here, and now Feral is saying what we most of us already know: If updating software and drivers become easier, without the need of going to the terminal, adding a new repository and installing software from there, or waiting for a new version of the distro to be released, it would make Linux a much more friendly platform.
Not only compiling stuff is annoying but the fact that going to the terminal scares a lot of potential users who want to get away from Windows. Mayor linux distributions needs a driver update center away from synaptic or app manager, so driver devs can post there the lastest stable drivers and then the user will be asked if he wants to update...
I agree, fully. The annoying thing is I usually get ridiculed when people find out how little I know about the terminal. It's part of the old attitudes we have to break through, to get it into people's minds. You shouldn't have to learn terminal to be able to use Linux.

It's not as bad as it used to be, we have way more tools exposed via a decent UI than we did 2-3 years ago. The situation has slowly improved for sure, but this is certainly something that should be handled better.

As much as people like to rag on Gnome I feel like Gnome and Elementary have done so much to simplify the Linux system into a UX that puts Terminal Master power into a simple easy to get UX.

Apps keep emerging and cherry picking the best can lead to a mostly GUI Linux these days, Etcher for iso dd, Pantheon Files / Nautilus for MC, Noise / Lollipop / Gnome Music for simple Music Management, Epiphany is a simple browser, Gnome Control Center Alt will be a simpler control panel more like iPad, gedit / scratch as simple text editors, Gnome Builder as simplified Microsoft Visual Studio on Linux, Documents, Photos, (Too bad Gnome Books has been undeveloped it was looking cool in addition to evince Document Viewer)

And the list goes on. We must all remember that: Genius Simplifies as Ignorance Complicates

Linux should be built so amazingly that a user never should have to issue terminal commands. It should be fast and options concise and not needlesly convoluted or complicated.
calexil 18 November 2016 at 10:08 pm UTC
HARUMPH!
ElectricPrism 18 November 2016 at 10:12 pm UTC
JajcusI don't understand why distributions like Ubuntu don't stick up with current Mesa releases. It is not like Mesa API or ABI changes with every update and whole distribution needs recompiling. The API/ABI is mostly OpenGL, which is backward-compatible practically to the very beginning. Mesa also has very solid development process and continuous integration infrastructure, so regressions are extremely rare and quickly fixed.

I see no reason for Ubuntu released last year not getting an updated to Mesa 13.0.1. Getting it compiled with LLVM recent enough for full functionality of the Radeon drivers might be a problem, though.

Possible reasons:

1. Ubuntu thinks it's a good idea to have 15 versions of Ubuntu they have to deliver patches and updates for

2. Idalisticly Ubuntu thinks 6 month release cycle will create more stable software by forcing developers to stabalize their apps for each major releases of Ubuntu. Actuality Developer App bug fixes are often prevented from making their way to users making Ubuntu software stale by not being rolling release. They capitolize on people's fear of the unknowns of Rolling Release to convince people it's a good idea.

3. Canonical holds the keys to the Ubuntu Garden and compiles all apps with their own set of patches. They often do this once or seldom per 6 month release cycle.

They also shamelessly rebrand the the Linux Kernel as the Ubuntu Kernel. Morally debatable I suppose.

4. Canonical believes & convinces users that by controlling when App updates get pushed to users they are creating stability & security.

This may be a partial truth. But what is also true is that for a long time Ubuntu 12.04 LibreOffice users had packages 2 years old because Ubuntu 12.04 required Library version X.Y which made it impossible for users to get the new LibreOffice.

5. Canonical loves the plublicity of all the blog and news sites to talk about their new version. The backlinks, posts on social media, blog posts and howto: guides have "made a big noise" generating interest in Ubuntu twice a year.

6. Canonical has their limited vision & limited number of employees divided on many different things at once. Mir, Ubuntu Phone, Ubuntu IoT, Ubuntu Tablet, Ubuntu Server and Ubuntu Cloud. They're trying to be the king of too many hills and are spread thin, their mission has become vauge and their purpose dulled.


Last edited by ElectricPrism at 18 November 2016 at 10:15 pm UTC
tmtvl 18 November 2016 at 10:16 pm UTC
Mandatory Open Build Service plug. It provides One Click Installs for OpenSUSE devices, and creates both repositories and packages for CentOS, Debian, OpenSUSE, RHEL, SLE, Ubuntu,...

Also mandatory "Ubuntu software is 3 versions out of date" joke.
TingPing 18 November 2016 at 10:42 pm UTC
ErikchtWITHOUT AMD DRIVER THAT USE CATALYST, I cannot switch it by ubuntu to force on steam for linux
I hope this changes with an easy way on Mesa + ubuntu

It is actually so much easier with the open drivers. You can just set the env var DRI_PRIME=1 and an application will use the secondary GPU. More info: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PRIME


Last edited by TingPing at 18 November 2016 at 10:42 pm UTC
MayeulC 19 November 2016 at 3:55 pm UTC
I support the idea, but I am afraid this could be complicated in practice: you have to provide a compatible version of the kernel, llvm compiler, Mesa state tracker, as well as the Xorg components (with a compatible Xorg version).

Lots of breakage opportunities. The alternative is of course a rolling distribution.
Ehvis 19 November 2016 at 9:58 pm UTC
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It appears Feral also upgraded their radar. All the glitches are gone! Kind of boring really.
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