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Quoting: tmtvlProprietary games using GNU/Linux APIs are bad. For example, Egosoft's X3 uses a GTK2 application to launch and GTK2 is no longer being updated (it's even been removed from the official Arch repositories). Because it's proprietary software the community can't just take it over and update it to use GTK3 or 4.

I think issues like that can be helped by targeting the Steam Linux Runtime instead of a specific Linux distribution. Steam Linux Runtime may not provide everything, but it is stable, so I think that makes it less likely to cause breakage as the stack of libraries advances.

Quoting: StellaPretty much all existing Linux games suffer from various problems ranging from complete inplayability over control and gameplay/visual issues as well as crashes.

Even the open source Linux games and apps like SuperTuxKart, SuperTux, Veloren, or UZDoom? I would think that, since those games are open source, they would have better support for Linux, since they are open to bug reports and code contributions from anyone who cares.

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More mods on Steam is always great. 🔥

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Quoting: Caldathras

Quoting: g000hAs soon as Californians are no longer able to legally run Linux, their own citizens will go after this law and end the moronic political overreach.

This assumes that the majority of Californians are Linux users. Linux is not significant enough to overturn this law. Besides, the majority of eligible voters are indifferent sheep ... they are more likely to just accept or ignore the overreach.

Well the alternative is just giving up and result in Linux dying. Is that what you want? BTW California state includes Big Tech utopia Silicon Valley. Love to see Google and Meta trying to run without access to open source.

It appears that Meta is responsible for causing this political upheaval - Lobbying politicians in these areas. (Meta gets to avoid big fines if it passes age verification onto operating systems and app stores.)

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My thoughts: its a well known fact that there is plenty of sites using steam CS crates for gambling, they claim they've gone through a lot of effort dismantling the operations of these sites... well its a fact that those sites are still operational, you just can search on google or any search engine and you'll get plenty of results, valve is indirectly responsible for this.
I mean as they say, these crates have been on valve for more than 20 years, and still they cannot get their shit together on completely banning these sites?
its the analog of being the organizer of a sports event and not being diligent, strict enough and allowing the resale and scalping of your tickets for an event... yeah they are kinda responsible.

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Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: dimko

Quoting: Mountain ManSony doesn't want to sell games, they want to sell PlayStations and lock customers inside their walled garden.

What is profit from locking someone into their walled garden? Define it and explain how it benefits them. :D

When someone buys a PlayStation, they're naturally going to want to buy games for it, and when they buy a PlayStation game, Sony gets a bigger cut of that sale than they would selling that same game on PC. The more games someone buys for their PlayStation, the more vested they are in the platform, and the more likely they are to buy the next iteration of the console, and the cycle repeats.

I am gonna be pedantic. YOu contradict yourself. You said earlier they don't want to sell games.(which is what I am outisting about), but i get your point now.

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On one hand, how valve does lootboxes is one of my only legitimate complaints with them, and them losing this lawsuit would lead to positive changes in the industry.

But then the New York office makes me opposed to them losing this by default because they bundled the win condition with ID verification. So I hope New York loses, because I hate ID verification normalization more than I hate lootboxes, ESPECIALLY as a Californian that's unsure if I'll be kicked out of using linux distros I want next year cause of the boneheaded, technologically ignorant decrepit boomer decisions of people I didn't even vote for.

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This is very nice. I wonder who else will reveal some revelations!

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You are wrong!!!

Jokes aside..

I used Fedora Workstation for years. I am now running Bazzite Gnome (because I do like the super button workflow a lot).

I ended up with bazzite because I really had issues with multimedia, codecs, mesa and so on. I would love a plain silverblue with that included.

Even after switching ffmpeg, mesa and installing pulse plugins and orher things, I encountered issues with formats and codecs.

For me that situation is what makes fedora quite a pain. I have the philosophy if it does not run out of the box it does not run well and never will.

Bazzite or generally ublue with codecs is a treat. As is bluebuild (took me like 30 minutes to make a Fedora immutable with codecs and Cosmic Desktop to try out without any prior knowledge on how it works).

And as I found out, homebrew actually can bring me most of the libs and compilers I need for development, so I do not need them on a system level.

I do not like some decisions bazzite makes (I'd like a more ootb experience - who needs that ugly minimize animation they added in gnome, really), but its the best I have for now.

I will probably in time make my own bluebuild for gnome. But there I need some more tweaking for autoupdates and things like that (I do not care about making updates manually... I am lazy).

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Yes, please! More native builds! Proton is great, but there is never anything better than running software without layers and wrappers.

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Quoting: AsciiWolfSo you think that native Linux apps/games are inherently bad. Why bother with Linux and not just use Windows in that case?

Proprietary games using GNU/Linux APIs are bad. For example, Egosoft's X3 uses a GTK2 application to launch and GTK2 is no longer being updated (it's even been removed from the official Arch repositories). Because it's proprietary software the community can't just take it over and update it to use GTK3 or 4.

I suppose a better way to put it is that native GNU/Linux games aren't bad, they just need more machinery to keep working than games targetting the Windows APIs (although of course one could just set up a system with ancient versions of everything, I mean that's Debian's entire shtick).

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Quoting: voytrekkI think the only thing that Valve should be punished on is the fact that you cannot use another marketplace to trade items. It locks users into a single marketplace that Valve just happens to collect a fee on each transaction. Either take away the fee or allow other marketplaces to compete with Valve.

You want another marketplace to be able to compete with Valve on selling digital items hosted on Valve's platform...?

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The MtG comparison actually fits quite well, only that trading card games would be even more problematic, because each boosterpack has a chance to give you an advantage while playing. In Valves games the benefits are purely cosmetic.

Gambling is a serious topic and its a discussion we´ve got to have. But I personally dont think trading card games should be banned and - by extension - neither should Valves marketplace.

@voytrekk: You are wrong, there are tons of alternate marketplaces for CS2 stuff etc. I find them all a bit cumbersome and shady, but its one of the great things about Valve, that they dont lock you down. You can trade user-to-user or use these marketplaces without giving a penny to Valve.

For that exact reason, PUBG descided to lock down trades after a while (changing all items to "marketable - non tradeable", because they got greedy and didn´t want to miss out on fees.

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Quoting: felipecrsToo bad Danger Zone mode isn't playable. I hope they fix that, so at least it can be played in community servers.

It is available in community servers.

https://discord.gg/dangerzone

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I think the only thing that Valve should be punished on is the fact that you cannot use another marketplace to trade items. It locks users into a single marketplace that Valve just happens to collect a fee on each transaction. Either take away the fee or allow other marketplaces to compete with Valve.

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I think it's great they're adding official Linux/SteamOS/Deck/Machine targets. Maybe sometimes they won't work and then we will resort to Proton, but it's still a huge step benefiting the developers who otherwise might be reluctant to develop for Linux. It's all about the friction.

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Let's strike a compromise and just ban anything where you pay a certain amount of money but don't know what you're getting back: lootboxes, gambling, card packs, kinder surprise, mystery game bundles, lotteries, taxes...

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I've been playing Linux native games (Unity, no less) that I had bought ten years ago without any issue. What is there left to improve?

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Director of the one of the 2 most common game engines promises improved native Linux support, and of course it is the "Linux gamers" shitting on it in favour of Windows games via Proton.

Once again, the biggest undoing of Linux games is the Linux gamers. Sigh...

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If they can pull it off, nice.

It's what plenty of folks have been saying a long time. With Proton they can establish Linux as a proper gaming platform. Native solutions would eventually follow.

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Very nice. Didn't expect that given the massive success of Proton.

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What they say is not a good reason not to ban lootboxes and other predatory business practices. It's really just fair to have a good look at the real life equivalents they mentioned, as well. When they say MTG is the same thing, they're right. They also make people overspend for little value in return. I wouldn't mind banning that stuff, too. Collectibles have been a thing since forever, but I am not sure at what point it become acceptable not to tell people what they're buying.

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Quoting: Stella

But I think we can do better with a native solution.

I hard disagree with this statement. Pretty much all existing Linux games suffer from various problems ranging from complete inplayability over control and gameplay/visual issues as well as crashes. Running games over Proton is vastly preferable to Native most of the time because the Windows API is much more stable than the Linux API. I myself have had so many issues with native ports that the Proton versions never have, that I've given up on them completely

So you think that native Linux apps/games are inherently bad. Why bother with Linux and not just use Windows in that case?

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Multiplayer? OK I guess.
Good game, I like it as single player . . . I suppose I'm just not much of a multiplayer fan.

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Quoting: KandarihuI don't think that this is the right approach. As much as I want Linux to grow as a platform, this gives us an unfair advantage. The better choice will be to scrap/abolish such legislation entirely.

As a general rule, I am fine with open source having unfair advantages. For one thing, closed source things do their best to create obstacles and disadvantages for open source. If you can't stop your opponent from cheating, better cheat back. For another, I can see very sound public policy objectives that can be served by preferences for open source. Government does not have a responsibility to make the playing field level, it has a responsibility to make the results of the game good for its citizens. If open source is better for the country and its citizens, then favour it.

In this specific case, I agree that the best choice would be to scrap this kind of legislation entirely. However, if that is not on the table, an unfair advantage for open source would be better than nothing.

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Quoting: grigiWow, did not expect this.

Is this the start of the Linux picks up mainstream developer mindshare thing?
Or is Unity just trying to have it covered in case that happens?

More the latter than the former, I expect. The last time we had Steam Machines announced we got 40% of games released on Steam having a native Linux build, and game engines stepped up their Linux support, based on the potential of a new market. Since those Steam Machines didn't really happen in the end, that support withered.

This time around I think there'll be less withering. The Deck is a proven market, and media are much more positive about Linux than they were then. Linux support is less acceptable to allow to drop than it was then. But the driving force to improve Linux support is the potential of a bigger future market, just as it was then.

Of course, back then, OpenGL support was about the same on Windows, Mac and Linux, so you could avoid duplication of work. Vulkan support on Windows isn't that great, and it's non-existent on Mac, so there'll be more platform-specific duplication of work this time around.

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But I think we can do better with a native solution.

I hard disagree with this statement. Pretty much all existing Linux games suffer from various problems ranging from complete inplayability over control and gameplay/visual issues as well as crashes. Running games over Proton is vastly preferable to Native most of the time because the Windows API is much more stable than the Linux API. I myself have had so many issues with native ports that the Proton versions never have, that I've given up on them completely

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Bureaucratic overreach. As usual, they know that their demands cannot be backed up by existing law. They're just hoping that businesses and citizens will give in to their demands without questioning the legal validity of those demands.

We've seen the same conduct here in Canada, just in different industries.

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But I think we can do better with a native solution.

Oh really? 🤔

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Wow, did not expect this.

Is this the start of the Linux picks up mainstream developer mindshare thing?
Or is Unity just trying to have it covered in case that happens?

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Quoting: g000hAs soon as Californians are no longer able to legally run Linux, their own citizens will go after this law and end the moronic political overreach.

This assumes that the majority of Californians are Linux users. Linux is not significant enough to overturn this law. Besides, the majority of eligible voters are indifferent sheep ... they are more likely to just accept or ignore the overreach.

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