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Supraland, the colourful and inviting first-person puzzle game from Supra Games is now going to be removed from game store GOG after less than a year being there.

Looking at the dates: it released on Steam in April 2019, then came to Linux in July that same year and then onto GOG in that same month. Today, June 9 in 2020 the GOG team posted on their forum that Supraland will be delisted from their store at the developer's request but it will stay in your GOG library. That's not long to be on a store to then ask for it to be removed, so why?

The developer has been quite vocal about it all, as it turns out. Back in July 2019, we posted an article about the developer saying some strange stuff about both GOG and Linux and it seems their opinion didn't change after being live on GOG for some time, as they said on Steam in May this year:

Going onto GOG I expected maybe something like 10% of Steam, but it's more like 1%. Same with releasing a Linux version. It's all worth so little for us that it's rather annoying to have to do the extra work all the time and carry that weight around. I wouldn't do it again.

Sounds like a case of heavily inflated expectations, mixed with some naivety. Still, it's better to request removal than to leave it up and not support it at all, so it sounds like they're doing the right thing overall.

In other posts they also mentioned how in relation to DRM-free gaming that "98-99% of players don't care" and that if there's any "crying about DRM stuff in the gamer scene, it must come from a really vocal but tiny minority. 1-2% tiny". That's some pretty tough words for the DRM-free crowd.

As for the Linux build of Supraland, it appears to have been suffering a few issues lately as posts on Steam will show and the developer isn't sure what they will do so the Linux build may be pulled too see: #1 and #2. They've never been particularly confident about it either as they said before a few times, and it appears they don't know how to support the Linux version. If they do announce a decision on that bit, we will let you know.

Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
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TheSHEEEP 12 Jun
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Quoting: ShmerlI'm surprised their issue was some API integration. I guess achievements and such? Not something I really care about. It's one thing to rely on those APIs for multiplayer game and having trouble supporting multiple backends. Making a big deal out of it for a single player one and then pulling out of the store because of it, that sounds very misguided.
I'm also not fully buying it.
How hard can it be to implement achievements if you have already done it for another game (and GOG & Steam as well).
It's not like these APIs change a lot.
scaine 12 Jun
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Quoting: ageres
Quoting: scaineDenuvo is a kernel driver for DRM, as well as anti-cheat.
Denuvo anti-cheat is, but Denuvo anti-tamper is just an obfuscator. It hurts performance on weak CPUs but doesn't mess with an OS afaik.
Steam DRM, on the other hand, prevent Linux gamers from playing a bunch of PS360 era games: https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton/issues/753. Those games run fine with cracked exes though.

"Just" an obfuscator? Weirdly, that sounds like you're defending it. Maybe you are. I suppose some people might prefer Denuvo to CEG because at least some Denuvo games run in Proton, but given that those games run with higher CPU, and lower framerates, at that point, I don't really care if it's a rootkit or not, I want nothing to do with it.

Can you imagine if this was applied to cars, clothes, or hell, burgers?

Cars: worse performance, you can't lend to a (insured) friend. Maybe you can only fill it from certain stations, or drive it on certain roads. Probably costs more as a result.
Clothes: Harder to put on, doesn't last as long, can't dye it, can't hand-me-down to others. Probably costs more as a result.
Burger: tastes longer to cook, can't share it with your son/daughter. Probably costs more as a result.

It's just weird. My entire steam library is mine and mine alone. When I die, even if I give the steam login to my children, they can't transfer the games to their account, it's completely locked. They're scaine, or nothing.

Defending DRM is such a strange position. And I know I've done it in the past, but the more I think about it, the more annoying and invasive I realise it is. Maybe one day I'll give up on Steam, but that would require a linux-friendly competitor to offer DRM-free gaming on a platform with vaguely similar features... and I doubt that will happen in my lifetime.


Last edited by scaine on 12 June 2020 at 9:58 pm UTC
ageres 13 Jun
Quoting: scaine"Just" an obfuscator? Weirdly, that sounds like you're defending it.
You've said that it messes with an OS kernel, I've said it doesn't. I don't like Denuvo either. It still doesn't let me play my games sometimes, e.g when I lose my Internet connection. Yet I prefer Steam over GOG.
dvd 15 Jun
QuoteIn other posts they also mentioned how in relation to DRM-free gaming that "98-99% of players don't care" and that if there's any "crying about DRM stuff in the gamer scene, it must come from a really vocal but tiny minority. 1-2% tiny". That's some pretty tough words for the DRM-free crowd.

Well if the DRM is obnoxious, most of the people i know are happy to wait for the DRM-free release (so to speak :) ).
Eike 17 Jun
Quoting: omer666
Quoting: Eike
Quoting: omer666
Quoting: EikeYou complained that "DRM doesn't trust you and treats you as a potential criminal apriory." - and that's what you're doing with random foreign people as well, and for a reason. There's bad people out there.

So, you cannot demand trust from companies (or other foreign people
I don't know where you're from, but here in France if a shopkeeper starts being suspicious towards his clients, they just leave the shop and never come back.

So, shop detectives, electronic door devices to scan for stolen stuff labels (CDs, clothes, ...) or other theft prevention isn't a thing in our neighbor country? I find that hard to believe (and would search on my own of you insist that would be true).
You are right to make that point, but the fact I didn't make a link between DRM and those devices is quite revealing. I think more of DRM like "let's go through our customer's stuff because something may be wrong" than a simple automatic check (stuff paid for/stuff not paid for). In that case, CD Key looks more like theft prevention than DRM. But that's just how I see it.

I was only talking about if there's a justification for DRM, not about how it is done. I don't know if there's a working non-intrusive way to do it... I don't want people to sift through my stuff, neither in shops not on my PC for sure.
Shmerl 17 Jun
The answer is - there isn't a way, unless there is a probable cause. To put it differently, searching through someone stuff becomes justified if someone is investigating a crime or something. But to do it preemptively - that's already a problem and overstepping of privacy. DRM oversteps it always, so that should give a hint that it's never valid.
slaapliedje 23 Jun
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I skipped a bunch of posts, just wanted to pop in and say Conan Exiles dropped Denuvo recently, so may have to try it again under Linux. I think it originally was supposed to have Linux support...
slaapliedje 24 Jun
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Quoting: ShmerlThe answer is - there isn't a way, unless there is a probable cause. To put it differently, searching through someone stuff becomes justified if someone is investigating a crime or something. But to do it preemptively - that's already a problem and overstepping of privacy. DRM oversteps it always, so that should give a hint that it's never valid.
Yeah, the comparison to the shop owners would be instead of just cameras looking for shoplifters, they actuvely search you from head to toe before you enter the store, and before you leave it.
Think of basically the TSA every time you enter a shop. Would you shop there?

The DRM choice from what I understand is usually one made by the lublishers, nit the developers. And I think most publisher / developers these days think of DRM as only an initial protection to try to make as money as they can before the pirates crack their stuff and distribute it for free. It is a cost / loss analysis. I think as soon as they realize they are making less money from new sales as they are for paying for their DRM, then drop the DRM, as Conan Exiles has done.

One thing that is weird to think of? Video games finally got to the point where companies make all of their money selling their Engines to other video game developers. DRM has done the same thing, where they are just paid for licensing!

Remember the days of Codewheels? Those were cool.
tuubi 24 Jun
Quoting: slaapliedjeRemember the days of Codewheels? Those were cool.
Remember these?
Eike 24 Jun
Quoting: tuubi
Quoting: slaapliedjeRemember the days of Codewheels? Those were cool.
Remember these?

I'm near to tears.
Got Jet Set Willy II for MSX on cassette. (And I've been to the island...!)


Last edited by Eike on 24 June 2020 at 1:35 pm UTC
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