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Pop!_OS from Linux hardware vendor System76 is set to get a massive upgrade when Pop!_OS 21.04 releases, as they've announced COSMIC - their very own desktop environment.

"We’re providing a honed desktop user experience in Pop!_OS through our GNOME-based desktop environment: COSMIC. It’s a refined solution that makes the desktop easier to use, yet more powerful and efficient for our users through customization. The new designs are developed from extensive testing and user feedback since the Pop!_OS 20.04 release, and are currently being further refined in their testing phase."

Check out their animated mock-up (Credit - System76):

Much like Ubuntu do with their own adjustments to GNOME to add a proper dock, System76 will be adding one for COSMIC too. They say it will be adjustable to be available wherever you want it - be it at the bottom, the left or the right of your screen and you can have it stretch across if you want it to and auto-hide too. Traditional minimizing to the dock will also be a thing, which GNOME also lacks out of the box.

It will have the Activities Overview you get split into two special views of Workspaces and Applications. They say that "the Workspaces view will allow you to view your open windows and workspaces, while the Applications view will open an application picker". Why did they go with this design? The reason is simple according to the blog post as they "found that even GNOME veterans have a tendency to pause in their task after opening the Activities Overview" and that this split view allows "you to access the application picker in a single click, while the cleaner UI design prevents visual distraction".

Much like Pop already does, the team is focusing on letting users decide how to use it. There will be all the bells and whistles for both mouse-driven and keyboard-driven users. According to System76 CEO, Carl Richell, COSMIC will be based upon GNOME 3.38 for the 21.04 release then 40 for 21.10 (Twitter).

Since this is a big change, it's also going to delay the release of Pop!_OS 21.04 to June 2021 instead of April. Find out more in their blog post. Those interested in code can see it already on GitHub.

Very much looking forward to giving COSMIC a go when Pop!_OS 21.04 releases.

Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
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slaapliedje 21 Apr
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  • Supporter Plus
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).

1. A single panel on the left would make sense. Menu button on the left bottom, close button on the right top and workspace overview / activities would still be available. And the lost space is where you rarely need it.
2. I have the cinnamon workspace overview there.
3. I don't see any use of a panel on the top, and a panel / dock on the bottom. It's a waste of vertical space.
slaapliedje 21 Apr
View PC info
  • Supporter Plus
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).

1. A single panel on the left would make sense. Menu button on the left bottom, close button on the right top and workspace overview / activities would still be available. And the lost space is where you rarely need it.
2. I have the cinnamon workspace overview there.
3. I don't see any use of a panel on the top, and a panel / dock on the bottom. It's a waste of vertical space.
I think the only issue with a panel on the left/right only is text doesn't display very well in a small column (at least with latin languages!) In my mind a top panel with clock and indicator and notifications popping down always made more sense to me in modern UIs than a bottom dock/panel. Here's why. Basically when you open an application, you have a title bar, with the Title of the app, maybe some information, and the Minimize / Maximize / Close (unless you're using standard Gnome, which for some dumb reason ditched minimize/maximize, I re-enable those, but also add the middle mouse click as minimize so I can click anywhere on the bar and have it go away temporarily). The title bar is generally up at the top, so having a panel up along the top with it leads to some readability, as you can get the info of the program name and maybe the tab name, depending on app, but also the clock is right up there, so you can check the time, etc. Throwing your eyes to the bottom right for a time check is extra work, really. It was fine on old 4:3 screens that were 14-21" in size, less so on larger screens).
Older UIs (like the Amiga) are different, as there are UI elements / Information in the bottom of the window in certain cases, or will show there are more icons in workbench that you can scroll left / right. Then again, it also has a menu bar up top with the information. In fact, when I think about older operating systems.. Atari ST with GEM had the menu up top, Amiga, Mac... only major one that did not is Windows, and then KDE used it's paradigm, Gnome did the same thing in 1.x, then 2.x had the bottom / top panels (which became Cinammon and Mate's style) and then went to the top like the ST / Amiga / Mac. Mac later had added the Dock at the bottom as it was a thing in NeXT. And in my humble opinion is the wrong place for it. Whenever I use a mac, there is always something that irritates me about it, and that's one of them. I end up using the Spotlight function to launch programs, as that's more like what I'm used to with Gnome / Windows 10 / KDE. Ha, clicking on menus and trying to find an application in them seems like an ancient method to me. As does having to open a file manager to dig through folders for something. Though that's basically what I do on the ST / Amiga. But then in the case of those, I don't have software installs going all over the place and I can organize them any way I see fit :)
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).

1. A single panel on the left would make sense. Menu button on the left bottom, close button on the right top and workspace overview / activities would still be available. And the lost space is where you rarely need it.
2. I have the cinnamon workspace overview there.
3. I don't see any use of a panel on the top, and a panel / dock on the bottom. It's a waste of vertical space.
I think the only issue with a panel on the left/right only is text doesn't display very well in a small column (at least with latin languages!) In my mind a top panel with clock and indicator and notifications popping down always made more sense to me in modern UIs than a bottom dock/panel. Here's why. Basically when you open an application, you have a title bar, with the Title of the app, maybe some information, and the Minimize / Maximize / Close (unless you're using standard Gnome, which for some dumb reason ditched minimize/maximize, I re-enable those, but also add the middle mouse click as minimize so I can click anywhere on the bar and have it go away temporarily). The title bar is generally up at the top, so having a panel up along the top with it leads to some readability, as you can get the info of the program name and maybe the tab name, depending on app, but also the clock is right up there, so you can check the time, etc. Throwing your eyes to the bottom right for a time check is extra work, really. It was fine on old 4:3 screens that were 14-21" in size, less so on larger screens).
Older UIs (like the Amiga) are different, as there are UI elements / Information in the bottom of the window in certain cases, or will show there are more icons in workbench that you can scroll left / right. Then again, it also has a menu bar up top with the information. In fact, when I think about older operating systems.. Atari ST with GEM had the menu up top, Amiga, Mac... only major one that did not is Windows, and then KDE used it's paradigm, Gnome did the same thing in 1.x, then 2.x had the bottom / top panels (which became Cinammon and Mate's style) and then went to the top like the ST / Amiga / Mac. Mac later had added the Dock at the bottom as it was a thing in NeXT. And in my humble opinion is the wrong place for it. Whenever I use a mac, there is always something that irritates me about it, and that's one of them. I end up using the Spotlight function to launch programs, as that's more like what I'm used to with Gnome / Windows 10 / KDE. Ha, clicking on menus and trying to find an application in them seems like an ancient method to me. As does having to open a file manager to dig through folders for something. Though that's basically what I do on the ST / Amiga. But then in the case of those, I don't have software installs going all over the place and I can organize them any way I see fit :)

I still go for the Mint desktop (with a few chamges). I think Cinnamon never had a top panel as per default. I also use XFCE in some cases (single bottom panel of course). I like KDE in principle, but in my experience it never has been as stable amd issue free as Cinnamon or XFCE. Mate could be nice, but the window decorations tend to have close buttons that can't be reached in the top right corner, which makes me mad..
I'm also completely accustomed to look in the (bottom) panel for info (time, system messages, open windows/apps ...), and have my favourite apps clickable there. For rarely started apps I'm happy to use a menu, which NEVER changes the order or arrangement of apps, and/or which gives me a search option. There is no point in showing my favourite apps first in the menu too...
And I use the file manager all the time. I used to install KDE Dolphin for a long time, but imho Nemo is even better by now.
I guess what you prefer has a lot to do with what you're accustomed to... So have fun with your way! :)
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).

1. A single panel on the left would make sense. Menu button on the left bottom, close button on the right top and workspace overview / activities would still be available. And the lost space is where you rarely need it.
2. I have the cinnamon workspace overview there.
3. I don't see any use of a panel on the top, and a panel / dock on the bottom. It's a waste of vertical space.
I think the only issue with a panel on the left/right only is text doesn't display very well in a small column (at least with latin languages!) In my mind a top panel with clock and indicator and notifications popping down always made more sense to me in modern UIs than a bottom dock/panel. Here's why. Basically when you open an application, you have a title bar, with the Title of the app, maybe some information, and the Minimize / Maximize / Close (unless you're using standard Gnome, which for some dumb reason ditched minimize/maximize, I re-enable those, but also add the middle mouse click as minimize so I can click anywhere on the bar and have it go away temporarily). The title bar is generally up at the top, so having a panel up along the top with it leads to some readability, as you can get the info of the program name and maybe the tab name, depending on app, but also the clock is right up there, so you can check the time, etc. Throwing your eyes to the bottom right for a time check is extra work, really. It was fine on old 4:3 screens that were 14-21" in size, less so on larger screens).
Older UIs (like the Amiga) are different, as there are UI elements / Information in the bottom of the window in certain cases, or will show there are more icons in workbench that you can scroll left / right. Then again, it also has a menu bar up top with the information. In fact, when I think about older operating systems.. Atari ST with GEM had the menu up top, Amiga, Mac... only major one that did not is Windows, and then KDE used it's paradigm, Gnome did the same thing in 1.x, then 2.x had the bottom / top panels (which became Cinammon and Mate's style) and then went to the top like the ST / Amiga / Mac. Mac later had added the Dock at the bottom as it was a thing in NeXT. And in my humble opinion is the wrong place for it. Whenever I use a mac, there is always something that irritates me about it, and that's one of them. I end up using the Spotlight function to launch programs, as that's more like what I'm used to with Gnome / Windows 10 / KDE. Ha, clicking on menus and trying to find an application in them seems like an ancient method to me. As does having to open a file manager to dig through folders for something. Though that's basically what I do on the ST / Amiga. But then in the case of those, I don't have software installs going all over the place and I can organize them any way I see fit :)

I still go for the Mint desktop (with a few chamges). I think Cinnamon never had a top panel as per default. I also use XFCE in some cases (single bottom panel of course). I like KDE in principle, but in my experience it never has been as stable amd issue free as Cinnamon or XFCE. Mate could be nice, but the window decorations tend to have close buttons that can't be reached in the top right corner, which makes me mad..
I'm also completely accustomed to look in the (bottom) panel for info (time, system messages, open windows/apps ...), and have my favourite apps clickable there. For rarely started apps I'm happy to use a menu, which NEVER changes the order or arrangement of apps, and/or which gives me a search option. There is no point in showing my favourite apps first in the menu too...
And I use the file manager all the time. I used to install KDE Dolphin for a long time, but imho Nemo is even better by now.
I guess what you prefer has a lot to do with what you're accustomed to... So have fun with your way! :)
I use Mate with panel on the bottom because that's what I've always been used to, but I add a side panel on the right to put launchers on. Plus I usually put a "quit" button at the top or almost-top of the side panel (dropped just far enough so I don't accidentally hit it when I'm closing windows). As slaapliedje points out, there's plenty space at the side of our wide screens, and launchers work fine on a vertical thing.
slaapliedje 23 Apr
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Quoting: Purple Library Guy
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: Nevertheless
Quoting: slaapliedje
Quoting: riusma
Quoting: KohlyKohlThey should just switch to KDE and provide their own theme...

K-Pop!_OS ?
Not that I like KDE. But this cracks me up.

Curious... why do people like Docks? Personally I use the default Gnome setup because I like that it isn't constantly on my screen by default. I come from a long line of systems that didn't have task bars, and quit frankly like it that way. Windows 95-XP had a nice minimanlistic one that didn't take up extra vertical space. Gnome 2 was odd because they had the smaller panels, but were top/bottom. The gnome dock being off to the left and set to autohide makes so much more sense to me.

1) it is closer to the activities hot corner. So in one fluid movement I can fling the mouse to the upper left, then straight down to the dock to launch something without touching the keyboard. Or if I want to only use keyboard, meta key, then type, maybe some arrows, and enter. Boom launched application.
2) with the dock moved to the bottom of the screen (in both gnome 40 and Cosmic), you would have to go up, then down (assuming auto-hide is on, which for me it would be...)
3) now that screens are more commonly wide, ultrawide and super ultrawide... having a giant dock at the bottom with grey space around it looks REALLY hideous...

I like that you're talking detail. I think the classic Win95 style desktop has some big advantages!
1. Closing maximized windows by clicking in the top right corner without having to look.
2. Opening the system menu by clicking in the bottom left corner without having to look.
3. Favourite apps in the bottom panel. Why bothering to add an extra dock, dash, panel or whatever?
4. Workspace switcher in the panel.
5. Window list in the panel (no clicking, or using the keyboard).

I don't get what a top panel is good for. And even when I move it down in Gnome, the window close button is in a position that can not be reached with a click in the top right corner.
I absolutely love Cinnamon because of it!

1) Yeah, I don't maximize windows if I can help it. Ever. And especially on an ultra-wide screen, where (for example) web pages will never take advantage of them and you're left with huge amounts of white space on either side. Web pages don't scale well on wide screen displays, and irritate me that is what we all have moved to due to the movie industry...
2) yeah that's why I like the top left hot corner as well, I don't even have to click on Gnome, I just throw the mouse up there and it creates the 'activities' screen. Ha, when I went to a Apple store to have them look at my work macbook, the 'genius' visibly cringed when he activated the hot corner for the 'expose' thing that macs have. Made me chuckle.
3) That's the same thing I feel about the current Gnome dock. You can add favorites, you can right click on them for specific menu entries, and it'll create icons there as you open various tasks. Works quite fine, and with it auto-hiding, it's out of the way. Bottom of the screen, especially with ultra and super ultrawide screen displays, is a HUGE waste of pixels. I currently run at 3840x1200 on a 44" display, and that means I have like 8 icons on the bottom panel in Windows, and the rest is just useless as windows can't overlap that bar...
4) The gnome workspace switcher is nice, but the odd thing is, even though I always touted that as a great feature, I've rarely used it in the past, though when I think about it and use it, I love it. Especially when I have a task that is running in the background and I can just fling that to another window while watching netflix or something, and then just switch the work space to check it... But then I find myself liking just hitting the 'meta' key to bring up the activities screen where the movie on Netflix will still run while I can glance at a terminal.
5) and the window list in Gnome is just a key, or a flip to the hot corner away. I don't need to constantly know what applications are running. Side note to this though, I really did like the feature in Gnome 2 where copying functions showed progress in the task panel. I find it funny that Microsoft definitely snagged that idea and put it in Windows (I think 7 was the first time I saw it in an MS OS).

1. A single panel on the left would make sense. Menu button on the left bottom, close button on the right top and workspace overview / activities would still be available. And the lost space is where you rarely need it.
2. I have the cinnamon workspace overview there.
3. I don't see any use of a panel on the top, and a panel / dock on the bottom. It's a waste of vertical space.
I think the only issue with a panel on the left/right only is text doesn't display very well in a small column (at least with latin languages!) In my mind a top panel with clock and indicator and notifications popping down always made more sense to me in modern UIs than a bottom dock/panel. Here's why. Basically when you open an application, you have a title bar, with the Title of the app, maybe some information, and the Minimize / Maximize / Close (unless you're using standard Gnome, which for some dumb reason ditched minimize/maximize, I re-enable those, but also add the middle mouse click as minimize so I can click anywhere on the bar and have it go away temporarily). The title bar is generally up at the top, so having a panel up along the top with it leads to some readability, as you can get the info of the program name and maybe the tab name, depending on app, but also the clock is right up there, so you can check the time, etc. Throwing your eyes to the bottom right for a time check is extra work, really. It was fine on old 4:3 screens that were 14-21" in size, less so on larger screens).
Older UIs (like the Amiga) are different, as there are UI elements / Information in the bottom of the window in certain cases, or will show there are more icons in workbench that you can scroll left / right. Then again, it also has a menu bar up top with the information. In fact, when I think about older operating systems.. Atari ST with GEM had the menu up top, Amiga, Mac... only major one that did not is Windows, and then KDE used it's paradigm, Gnome did the same thing in 1.x, then 2.x had the bottom / top panels (which became Cinammon and Mate's style) and then went to the top like the ST / Amiga / Mac. Mac later had added the Dock at the bottom as it was a thing in NeXT. And in my humble opinion is the wrong place for it. Whenever I use a mac, there is always something that irritates me about it, and that's one of them. I end up using the Spotlight function to launch programs, as that's more like what I'm used to with Gnome / Windows 10 / KDE. Ha, clicking on menus and trying to find an application in them seems like an ancient method to me. As does having to open a file manager to dig through folders for something. Though that's basically what I do on the ST / Amiga. But then in the case of those, I don't have software installs going all over the place and I can organize them any way I see fit :)

I still go for the Mint desktop (with a few chamges). I think Cinnamon never had a top panel as per default. I also use XFCE in some cases (single bottom panel of course). I like KDE in principle, but in my experience it never has been as stable amd issue free as Cinnamon or XFCE. Mate could be nice, but the window decorations tend to have close buttons that can't be reached in the top right corner, which makes me mad..
I'm also completely accustomed to look in the (bottom) panel for info (time, system messages, open windows/apps ...), and have my favourite apps clickable there. For rarely started apps I'm happy to use a menu, which NEVER changes the order or arrangement of apps, and/or which gives me a search option. There is no point in showing my favourite apps first in the menu too...
And I use the file manager all the time. I used to install KDE Dolphin for a long time, but imho Nemo is even better by now.
I guess what you prefer has a lot to do with what you're accustomed to... So have fun with your way! :)
I use Mate with panel on the bottom because that's what I've always been used to, but I add a side panel on the right to put launchers on. Plus I usually put a "quit" button at the top or almost-top of the side panel (dropped just far enough so I don't accidentally hit it when I'm closing windows). As slaapliedje points out, there's plenty space at the side of our wide screens, and launchers work fine on a vertical thing.

I will say this, whenever I end up having to switch to using Windows, I find myself constantly going for that hot corner in the upper left... drives me nuts! Damn you Gnome for making me get used to that!

While we're on the subject of UIs... anyone else driven insane by Firefox's idea to get rid of the title bar and put tabs in there? Makes it hard to drag the damn window around...
wvstolzing 23 Apr
Quoting: slaapliedjeWhile we're on the subject of UIs... anyone else driven insane by Firefox's idea to get rid of the title bar and put tabs in there? Makes it hard to drag the damn window around...

I think they want the windows to be dragged from the blank spaces - as in the default configuration - on either side of the address bar. I resisted that setup at first, though I got used to it over time; I put the extension icons in the 'overflow menu' so the sides of the address bar are mostly empty.

I'm really not happy with some of the design changes in the current Nightly, though.
slaapliedje 23 Apr
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Quoting: wvstolzing
Quoting: slaapliedjeWhile we're on the subject of UIs... anyone else driven insane by Firefox's idea to get rid of the title bar and put tabs in there? Makes it hard to drag the damn window around...

I think they want the windows to be dragged from the blank spaces - as in the default configuration - on either side of the address bar. I resisted that setup at first, though I got used to it over time; I put the extension icons in the 'overflow menu' so the sides of the address bar are mostly empty.

I'm really not happy with some of the design changes in the current Nightly, though.
I just turn the title bar back on... like on android, I put the address bar back up top...
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