TUXEDO recently revealed two more AMD Ryzen laptops

Unfortunately, I don't think either of these Tuxedo laptops are all that impressive for a few reasons, especially when compared to Framework's offerings:

1. The Tuxedo Sirius 16 is stuck with a highly outdated 16:9 aspect ratio screen when most of the rest of the laptop world has moved to 16:10. Heck, Tuxedo has a 16:10 screen on their Pulse 14, Framework has a 16:10 screen on their 16 inch model that competes with the Sirius 16 and their 13.5 inch AMD Ryzen model that competes with the Pulse is even better at a 3:2 aspect ratio. It is lower resolution on the Framework Laptop 13.5 compared to the Tuxedo Sirius 14, but the 3:2 aspect ratio is much more desirable in my opinion. Even though the Pulse 14 does have a 120 hz screen, good luck having games hit above 60 hz on the Radeon 780M iGPU. Also, both of the Tuxedo laptops are dimmer than the Framework Laptops (both Framework Laptops hit 500 nits of brightness at maximum brightness compared to 400 nits on the Pulse 14 and 300 nits on the Sirius 16). The Tuxedo Sirius 16 screen on the other hand is worse in every way compared to the Framework Laptop 16; it is 16:9 versus 16:10, it is dimmer like I already mentioned, and it also has only a 100% sRGB color gamut coverage compared to 100% DCI-P3 color gamut coverage on the Framework Laptop 16.

2. Framework supports Ubuntu LTS and Fedora, two very popular Linux distros officially. If you're willing to install Linux, it's not a huge deal to install a Linux distro on either, but Tuxedo OS, the distro preinstalled on Tuxedo computers, doesn't even have KDE Plasma 6 yet (neither does Kubuntu or Ubuntu Studio), while Fedora 40 does! The TL;DR on this point? Both support Linux offically.

3. The Tuxedo Sirius 16 has a fingerprint reader that doesn't work with fprintd in Linux. The Tuxedo Pulse 14 only has an IR camera which as far as I know isn't supported in Linux at all. Both Framework Laptops do have working fingerprint sensors in both Windows and Linux (via fprintd, in GNOME's settings, or in KDE Plasma 6 and later's system settings).

4. The Tuxedo Laptops are pretty much DOA outside of the EU and the UK, as they only offer ISO layouts, while the Netherlands and everywhere outside of the EU and the UK use ANSI, which Tuxedo does not offer on these laptops. Not to mention how expensive the shipping costs are outside of Europe, so they may as well not exist outside of the EU.

5. While the Framework Laptops do ship with a slightly worse MediaTek 7922 Wi-Fi 6E & Bluetooth combo card (I have had issues with their Wi-Fi 6 and earlier cards, but not their 6E cards), it's like $20 to get an Intel AX210 Wi-Fi 6E card and because it's Framework, the replacement can be done rather easily if need be. So I wouldn't make a buying decision based on that alone.

6. The Framework Laptop 16 has a replaceable GPU, the Radeon RX 7700S, that is very similar in terms of performance to the Radeon RX 7600M in the Tuxedo Sirius 16. And the Ryzen 7 8845HS is basically the same as the 7840HS in the Framework Laptop 16 and very similar to the Ryzen 9 7940HS; the only benefit with the Ryzen 7 8845HS is the better NPU, which is kind of useless on Linux at the moment. Again, the Framework Laptop 16 can have its GPU upgraded in the future while the Tuxedo laptops cannot. And Framework has shown their long-term drop in upgrade support with the main boards, allowing for four different CPU options spanning three Intel CPU generations on their 13.5 laptop as well as an AMD Ryzen 7040U option. I have no doubt that this will continue with Intel Meteor Lake and Ryzen Zen 5 CPUs in the future. (They have already confirmed that they won't be offering Ryzen 8040 CPUs as they aren't much of an upgrade anyways like I've already said.)

7. The Framework Laptops have a more versatile port selection than the Tuxedo offers, both with the Expansion Card system allowing for a lot of flexibility, and also the two USB4 ports on the Framework Laptops compared to just one on each of the Tuxedo laptops. I will give the Tuxedo laptops a bit of praise for both having two SSD slots that can support 2 M.2 2280 drives with NAND chips on both sides. The Framework Laptop 13.5 can only support one SSD while the Framework Laptop 16 can only support one M.2 2280 slot with NAND chips on one side only (so a 4 TB limit in that slot because all of the 8 TB SSDs I've seen have NAND chips on both sides) and a 2 TB M.2 2230 SSD. If you want an 8 TB SSD or one with NAND chips on both sides, you're limited to one SSD. I understand why this limitation exists because of the motherboard design and that was all of the room they had, but that is a bonus for the Tuxedo laptops. However, both of the Framework Laptops have two RAM SO-DIMM DDR5 RAM slots. While the Tuxedo Sirius 16 also has two RAM slots, the Tuxedo Pulse 14 only has 32 GB of RAM as an option and it's soldered LPDDR5X RAM, meaning that's all you get. And while that amount of RAM is fine for most users, has slightly faster RAM speeds, lower power consumption, and 32 GB of RAM is standard on all configurations (there's no lower-end 16 GB of RAM option), if you need more RAM, you're SOOL for that laptop. That's a bit disappointing.

I will give the Tuxedo Sirius 16 another bonus point for having a BIOS/UEFI accessible MUX switch while Framework only offers AMD Smart Access Graphics when the expansion bay GPU is installed; there's no tool, either in Linux or even in the BIOS/UEFI, that can switch the internal screen's working GPU. While for Windows 11, that hasn't been a serious issue since the CASO update that bascially allows Optimus/iGPU gaming framerates to be within the margin of error of gaming directly on the dGPU, on Linux, as far as I know, there's no equivalent or way to bypass the iGPU on the internal screen, so on the Framework Laptop 16, unless you connect an external screen to the USB-C port on the Expansion Bay that connects directly to the dGPU, you will (at least for now) have to accept you will lose a bit of performance in games on the Framework Laptop 16. (This doesn't matter on the laptops with the iGPU only, including the Framework Laptop 16 without the dGPU installed in the Expansion Bay because they won't be hitting super high frame rates that tend to be the bottleneck for the iGPU when the screen is routed through it and because iGPU generally don't hit super high framerates in games anyway.)

Bonus: All of the laptops have a 1080p webcams with one exception; the Framework Laptops have a 1080p 60 fps webcam with both a webcam and microphone privacy shutter, the Tuxedo Sirius 16 has a 1080p 30 fps webcam with a wevam privacy shutter, and the Tuxedo Pulse 24 only has a 720p webcam with no privacy shutter. It does have an IR camera for Windows Hello, but that only works in Windows unfortunately.

Conclusion
For most people, if they had the choice between the Framework Laptop 16 and the Tuxedo Sirius 16, I would definitely recommend the Framework Laptop 16 over the Sirius 16 because the Framework Laptop 16 has many more advantages over the the Sirius 16 that I mentioned.

The battle between the Framework Laptop 13.5 (the version with an AMD Ryzen 7040U) and Pulse 14 (which has a more powerful AMD Ryzen 8040HS CPU that has a higher CPU power limit), on the other hand, is a lot closer. I'd personally go for the Framework Laptop 13.5 because I value repairability and upgradability, even for the RAM, but in this case, I can see some people preferring the Pulse 14 for its better CPU, higher refresh rate screen, and more SSD slots, as well as it's slightly faster RAM.

QuoteFingerprint reader (Windows-only)

Why on a laptop specifically aimed at Linux folk

Even if it comes with 32GB, the cheaper model is a deal breaker for me with onboard ram.

Are there any laptops targeted at Linux users that actually have a good keyboard? This one looks terrbile to me: a lowered key plate, no trackpoint, 10-key pad, iso layout, yuck. I'll keep buying Lenovo until something comes along with a nicer keyboard. While their keyboards have gotten worse over the years they still seem to be the best to me.

Quoting: torhamAre there any laptops targeted at Linux users that actually have a good keyboard? This one looks terrbile to me: a lowered key plate, no trackpoint, 10-key pad, iso layout, yuck. I'll keep buying Lenovo until something comes along with a nicer keyboard. While their keyboards have gotten worse over the years they still seem to be the best to me.

They do have a range with mechanical Cherry MX keyboards.

Quoting: cameronboschUnfortunately, I don't think either of these Tuxedo laptops are all that impressive for a few reasons, especially when compared to Framework's offerings:

<snip>

4. The Tuxedo Laptops are pretty much DOA outside of the EU and the UK, as they only offer ISO layouts, while the Netherlands and everywhere outside of the EU and the UK use ANSI, which Tuxedo does not offer on these laptops. Not to mention how expensive the shipping costs are outside of Europe, so they may as well not exist outside of the EU.

<snip>

Whenever I see articles about Tuxedo laptops, there is always a very quick reply saying, "they're rubbish, use Framework." but usually this is what is actually comes down to - you are not the target audience.

This very point in your list, is the very reason that many people do want Tuxedo gear. Sure, Tuxedo is DOA (hyperbole notwithstanding) outside of their target markets, but it works the other way around too.

I don't know many people who would relish the idea of having to RMA from Europe to the USA. I don't know what their repair/warranty policy is (they say 'limited warranty' for Europe) but my wife has had her Tuxedo almost five years. She works in textiles and the fans break down because small fibers gather inside. She is years beyond the warranty period, and they just send us a new fan whenever they start grinding - it arrives within a week.

Sometimes, it isn't meant for you, but it is for other people, if you can take a step back.


Last edited by JSVRamirez on 3 May 2024 at 6:09 am UTC

Quoting: cameronboschUnfortunately, I don't think either of these Tuxedo laptops are all that impressive for a few reasons, especially when compared to Framework's offerings:.

The problem with your opinion is that you don't have the experience with Tuxedo computers and most of the points you brought up, are pointless for a regular user. I bought Sirus gen.1, and here is my take on this:

Quoting: cameronbosch1. The Tuxedo Sirius 16 is stuck with a highly outdated 16:9 aspect ratio screen when most of the rest of the laptop world has moved to 16:10. [...].

Many laptops on the market still uses 16:9 aspect ratio and frankly, I don't care if the laptop has 16:9 or 16:10, the difference is too small. Sure, 16:10 would be better, but not by much.

Quoting: cameronbosch2. Framework supports Ubuntu LTS and Fedora, two very popular Linux distros officially. If you're willing to install Linux, it's not a huge deal to install a Linux distro on either, but Tuxedo OS, the distro preinstalled on Tuxedo computers, doesn't even have KDE Plasma 6 yet [..].

Tuxedo OS is just their flagship, recommended OS, but you can install any Linux distro you want, and most probably will do just that. I texted TUXEDO OS and despite it having newer kernel, newer Plasma stack (it was before Plasma 6 then) and newer drivers, the basis Ubuntu 22 was old and it was shown. There were numerous bugs that were long fixed but they are still present on Ubuntu 22. Some old packages and new ones were not working well with each other, creating various issues. So yeah, TUXEDO OS wasn't the best experience. However, the kernel on TUXEDO OS comes with TUXEDO patches that make Sirius laptop work well, while on other systems, there are issues with suspend. This is however a matter of time till it will be fixed. Other TUXEDO laptops don't have this problem. Sirus gen1 is just experimental, first model so such issues are to be expected.
Personally, I would think that TUXEDO OS should be a rolling release, but it's something they cannot do as it requires too much work.
I personally use Manjaro, so I have access to Tuxedo Control Center as well, and it doesn't have issues that TUXEDO OS have.

Quoting: cameronbosch3. The Tuxedo Sirius 16 has a fingerprint reader that doesn't work with fprintd in Linux. The Tuxedo Pulse 14 only has an IR camera which as far as I know isn't supported in Linux at all. Both Framework Laptops do have working fingerprint sensors in both Windows and Linux (via fprintd, in GNOME's settings, or in KDE Plasma 6 and later's system settings).

As far I am aware, they don't come with the fingerprint reader. This is just a casing that show a place for it, but it's not a functional fingerprint reader and Tuxedo never claimed anything different.

Quoting: cameronbosch4. The Tuxedo Laptops are pretty much DOA outside of the EU and the UK, as they only offer ISO layouts, while the Netherlands and everywhere outside of the EU and the UK use ANSI, which Tuxedo does not offer on these laptops. Not to mention how expensive the shipping costs are outside of Europe, so they may as well not exist outside of the EU.

I'm not sure what DOA means, but I live in EU so for me there is no issue. The shipping costs are what parcel companies offer. Such small company as Tuxedo cannot negotiate better prices. Most small companies will have similar shipping costs. This is what it is. For me this is OK, because Gemany is our neghebour so shipping costs are OK and pretty standard for shipping across the border.
As to the ISO layouts, then yeah. I expected that if I choose Polish layout, I will get the keys matched to my region, but no, they are typical German keys. Still, it turned out to be not a problem once I got to use them. The keyboard is great. I guess, TUXEDO is too small company to offer more flexibility. Again, it is what it is. Maybe some they they will grown big enough, but currently, take it as it is. If I were in US, I would buy System76. In Europe, I have TUXEDO or Slimbook. TUXEDO is close to me, so shipping is better, have better choice compared between those two, so I chose TUXEDO.

Quoting: cameronbosch5. While the Framework Laptops do ship with a slightly worse MediaTek 7922 Wi-Fi 6E & Bluetooth combo card (I have had issues with their Wi-Fi 6 and earlier cards, but not their 6E cards), it's like $20 to get an Intel AX210 Wi-Fi 6E card and because it's Framework, the replacement can be done rather easily if need be. So I wouldn't make a buying decision based on that alone.

Current models come with AX210 after I loudly criticized the Mediatek card, which is sh%$. I'm happy to see that they fixed this, but still I have no idea what came into their minds to use such weak and useless card as this Mediatek one.

Quoting: cameronbosch6. The Framework Laptop 16 has a replaceable GPU, the Radeon RX 7700S, that is very similar in terms of performance to the Radeon RX 7600M in the Tuxedo Sirius 16. And the Ryzen 7 8845HS is basically the same as the 7840HS in the Framework Laptop 16 and very similar to the Ryzen 9 7940HS; the only benefit with the Ryzen 7 8845HS is the better NPU, which is kind of useless on Linux at the moment. [...]

There is not much of a choice for laptop AMD dGPUs, so I guess they take whatever they have access to and whatever it makes a financial sense to them. TUXEDO is a much smaller company than Framework (probably, correct me if I am wrong), so they have to choose carefully. Even if the newer dGPU has no sense now, it could work better in the future, when the drivers mature.

Quoting: cameronbosch7. The Framework Laptops have a more versatile port selection than the Tuxedo offers, both with the Expansion Card system allowing for a lot of flexibility[..]

Hold your horses. Framework business model is to provide that versatility and that is UNIQUE to them. Tuxedo is just a different company with different business model. Besides, did you see the Framework prices? Sorry, they are too high. As much I would want such a laptop, it's too expensive. Tuxedo has much friendlier and normal price ranges. Still on an upper range, but since they offer more standard solutions (based on ready components, not manufactured only for them), the price can be more reasonable. You just can't compare TUXEDO and Framework.

Quoting: cameronboschI will give the Tuxedo Sirius 16 another bonus point for having a BIOS/UEFI accessible MUX switch while Framework only offers AMD Smart Access Graphics ==[...]

Yeah, nice to have a choice but frankly, who will use dGPU on a laptop for the whole session? Hybrid version works well enough. dGPU heats up and uses incredible amounts of power. It's enough to enable dGPU for a browser and the energy consuption, and fans kick in hard. No thanks. There is no real benefit to use dGPU for anything than gaming or graphical tasks. iGPU is powerful enough.

Quoting: cameronboschFor most people, if they had the choice between the Framework Laptop 16 and the Tuxedo Sirius 16, I would definitely recommend the Framework Laptop 16 over the Sirius 16 because the Framework Laptop 16 has many more advantages over the the Sirius 16 that I mentioned.

Again, price is also part of the consideration and in my book, Tuxedo wins. I would love to have Framework but again, it's out of my range. I already bought some extensions to my Tuxedo, so it costed almost 2000 EUR. For that price, I wouldn't even buy a basic option in Framework.

Having TUXEDO laptop, I can list more real issues than the ones you listed. For example, the speakers are too quiet and have no base. Sound is clear, and you can hear stereo sound, but it's flat and in general disappointing. Another issue may be how loud fans can be during gaming sessions, basically louder than sound from speakers, so I am forced to use headphones. This is a consequence of the slick design. Either you get a bulky, typical gaming laptop, or something smaller, looking nice, but must be ready for louder work when gaming. Since I mostly work on this laptop and game sporadically, this is fine by me. I love that the laptop is so lightweight. My previous Alienware laptop was almost 4kg, which was unpleasant to use on my knees...

On the other hand, Sirius gen1 have incredible chassis, very sturdy and on a level with Alienware laptops (I have one). This is something you didn't compare, maybe because there is no data on paper. This makes such comparison to be very flawed and narrow. Only having laptops from both companies physically, we could draw a proper comparison. Sadly, laptop reviewers only test laptops superficially, so they miss tons of stuff. If they have worked at least a week on such a laptop, they could get a much deeper understanding of the reviewed hardware. This makes us, the buyers, to be in a sad place. We have only paper data that miss a lot, and we still have to make a decision for better or worse.


Last edited by michaldybczak on 3 May 2024 at 5:40 pm UTC

Quoting: cameronbosch2. […] The TL;DR on this point? Both support Linux offically.

Sorry, TL;DR: You have no point. Tuxedo comes preinstalled with Tuxedo OS, Ubuntu, Kubuntu or Ubuntu Budgie. Framework does not have any Linux options. None. You either DIY or buy Windows.

Obviously, Tuxedo notebooks are compatible with other distributions, too. They even provide their packages for openSUSE (https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Infos/Help-and-Support/Instructions/Add-TUXEDO-Computers-software-package-sources.tuxedo).

As far as Linux support goes: Framework doesn't even compete with Tuxedo.

Quoting: cameronbosch4. The Tuxedo Laptops are pretty much DOA outside of the EU and the UK, as they only offer ISO layouts, while the Netherlands and everywhere outside of the EU and the UK use ANSI, which Tuxedo does not offer on these laptops. […]

They offer various ISO-QWERTY, QWERTZ & AZERTY layouts as well as US ANSI. For the Pulse you can even create a custom ANSI layout: https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Individual-Keyboards.tuxedo