Quoting: JordanPlayz158

Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: JordanPlayz158

Quoting: Mountain ManYes, let's pretend that the overwhelming majority of people using emulators aren't also playing pirated software.

Let's say that is the case, is that wrong? If so why is it wrong? Pirating games that are no longer officially produced or sold on consoles that are no longer officially produced or sold, is that wrong? The only argument that makes sense for copyright law that I've seen is to protect sales, but what sales are there left to protect?

Whether or not you agree with the law as it stands is irrelevant.

Ah, so to you it is irrelevant if it is morally correct or not (or the actual purpose of the law), but whether it is legal or not. I hope you will reflect on how you gauge what is wrong if the law ever tries to outlaw something like End-to-End Encryption (they have a few times and thankfully failed)

Oh, come off it. We're not fighting some moral crusade here. We're talking about video games. Let's try and keep things in perspective.

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Quoting: JordanPlayz158

Quoting: Mountain ManYes, let's pretend that the overwhelming majority of people using emulators aren't also playing pirated software.

Let's say that is the case, is that wrong? If so why is it wrong? Pirating games that are no longer officially produced or sold on consoles that are no longer officially produced or sold, is that wrong? The only argument that makes sense for copyright law that I've seen is to protect sales, but what sales are there left to protect?

Whether or not you agree with the law as it stands is irrelevant.

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Quoting: tuubi

Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: DesumAttacking game preservation is unethical. Selling hardware you know is defective is unethical. And those are just two very obvious examples.

Right, "game preservation", by which most people mean "free games". :tongue:

Nonsense. Game preservation [External Link] essentially means keeping games playable on modern hardware. It's not a hard concept to grasp. Emulation is an important part of it, for obvious reasons.

Your "most people" hypothesis is irrelevant in any case as long as this hurts paying customers as well.

Yes, let's pretend that the overwhelming majority of people using emulators aren't also playing pirated software. :grin:

You know the truth here, I know it, and Valve and Nintendo know it, which is why Valve offered to remove Dolphin from Steam, and Nintendo, unsurprisingly, said yes. I think what's most surprising about this story is that Valve allowed the emulator on Steam in the first place.

But as far as game preservation is concerned, there's really nothing Nintendo can do to stop it. As long as the internet exists and continues to be minimally regulated by governments, you will be able to download pretty much any game that has ever been created. The only reason the entire Commodore 64 library of games can still be download and played is, ironically, thanks to pirates. While emulation arguably falls into a legal grey area, and downloading pirated software is definitely illegal, it realistically can't be stopped.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: Desum"B-but these other companies are bad too"

So, if everyone else is being unethical and scummy, that makes it OK? I don't care about Sony either. Nintendo is an unethical company selling low-quality hardware and subsists mostly off of nostalgia addiction.

I'm not convinced that Nintendo is doing anything unethical.

Oh, come on, Mountain Man, they're a big corporation! That's like saying you're not convinced a politician is lying!

Sure, it's possible, in theory, that they have acted unethically at some point in the company's history, but in this instance, no. Valve asked them if they wanted the emulator removed from Steam and Nintendo said yes. There's nothing unethical happening here.

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Quoting: Desum

Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: Desum"B-but these other companies are bad too"

So, if everyone else is being unethical and scummy, that makes it OK? I don't care about Sony either. Nintendo is an unethical company selling low-quality hardware and subsists mostly off of nostalgia addiction.

I'm not convinced that Nintendo is doing anything unethical.

Attacking game preservation is unethical. Selling hardware you know is defective is unethical. And those are just two very obvious examples.

Right, "game preservation", by which most people mean "free games". :tongue:

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Quoting: robvvApparently, Valve initiated the conversation [External Link]... :grin:

That certainly puts a different spin on the story.

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Quoting: Desum"B-but these other companies are bad too"

So, if everyone else is being unethical and scummy, that makes it OK? I don't care about Sony either. Nintendo is an unethical company selling low-quality hardware and subsists mostly off of nostalgia addiction.

I'm not convinced that Nintendo is doing anything unethical.

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Quoting: Desum

Quoting: Mountain ManNintendo is just protecting themselves. I've never had a problem with that. They're still a great company.

No they are not. They are a soulless corporation who'd rather see games disappear forever than preserved, ultimately. They advocate for the worst kinds of DRM AND knowingly sell defective hardware to people (joycon analog drift ring a bell?) without fixing it for half a decade and counting.

Joystick drift is actually common across the industry. I know a number of Sony's more expensive controllers have suffered from it, but for whatever reason, they don't get hammered for it like Nintendo. And to be fair, Nintendo continues to offer a free Joy Con repair service, at least here in the US, so while they may not have offered the groveling apology that some people seem to want, they have implemented what I think is a reasonable remedy.

As far as game availability, they are really no better or worse than the majority of other publishers and developers in the industry. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Nintendo is just protecting themselves. I've never had a problem with that. They're still a great company.

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I ask myself, are politicians smarter than Microsoft's lawyers? And the answer is no.

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