Quoting: robvvI completely mis-read the title of this article!

Came here to write the same thing :woot:

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: CatKiller

Quoting: Eike

Quoting: Zapporwhen 64-bit linux client

why 64-bit linux client

The idea is that if Steam is 64-bit (but still able to launch all those 32-bit games that will never be updated) then distros (and users) can drop all those (poorly secured) 32-bit packages that are no one wants to (or even really does) maintain.

The reasons for Ubuntu's (premature) desire to drop the maintenance and packaging of 32-bit packages at the same time as they dropped their 32-bit install images are still true, it's just that the infrastructure for ruining 32-bit proprietary applications on an entirely 64-bit system weren't yet up to the task. Without a significant push, it'll never be up to the task, and Valve dragging their feet on removing their dependency on 32-bit packages delays that push.

As I understand it.

But where would all those 32 bit games get their environment from?
As I understand it, a single 32 bit game I want to run would eliminate the advantages, right?

I believe the thinking is that Valve would provide them in their sandboxed "linux runtime", that way they would only be reachable for those old never to be updated anyway 32-bit games and thus could be removed from the system directories and from the distributions.

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Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedjeI bet you if there could be alt stores to snap, no one would hate it as much as they do.

Well that is the situation today but people still hate it as much as they do. Now there AFAIK does not yet exist such a store, but there _could_ do since everything needed to build it is available, it's just that no one have bothered and that is hardly Canonical:s fault.

I'd like to be proven wrong, but I'm pretty sure their backend is tied very much into their client.

The URL to the store is most likely hardcoded in the source code of snapd, but the code is open so it can be forked and so far we don't know how Canonical would treat a patch that changes that to a config value under say /etc/snap.d/.

Right, but who would want to bother when you can just use flatpak? :)

Of course, but then perhaps also at the same time stop the hate for snap? I mean that was the context, not that you had to use it ;)

My actual problem with snap is how difficult it is to remove it from an Ubuntu system... well less about how difficult it is, but it's annoying that it breaks the Ubuntu Software Center when you do. If you want to just use flatpak / debs, you're basically going to be using gnome-software (if you want gui).

One can always criticize the implementation of course. I have zero experience with the software center since I only use apt directly and thus had zero problems removing snap from e.g servers (I run a few micro servers at aws where I had to really squeeze out every available byte of RAM).

But I can guess that it is difficult since they obviously want their users to use snap so they have built it into the system basically.

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Quoting: Sslaxx

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: Mumrik93Where did Atari get the money to buy them? The Atari VCS was a massive failure on so many levels I have issues believing any bank would be inclined to give them a loan.

They received €12.5M from their share holders last year by way of a rights issue and got a €2.4M loan from Irata LLC, according to their latest report they are still not profitable and had a higher loss in 2022-H2 then 2022-H1

Hmmm . . . maybe they said to the banks "Look, we aren't profitable, we have no idea how to start turning a profit, and we already owe you money. Our only chance of paying it back is if we take over someone who can make a profit and use their money. Lend us more so we can do that!"

They might go for it--that's more or less the business model of a lot of private equity firms.

I don't think they have talked to any banks, Irata LLC who they loaned money from looks to be a holding company controlled by the CEO of Atari (Wade Rosen) so it looks like he is for some reason trying to take over the company from the other owners. And it took me until right now before I realied that Irata is atarI spelled backwards...

Also Wade owns 13% of Night Dive. Come to a deal with them to carve up Atari, perhaps?

The plot thickens indeed. Not sure why though, the company does not go well economically.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: Mumrik93Where did Atari get the money to buy them? The Atari VCS was a massive failure on so many levels I have issues believing any bank would be inclined to give them a loan.

They received €12.5M from their share holders last year by way of a rights issue and got a €2.4M loan from Irata LLC, according to their latest report they are still not profitable and had a higher loss in 2022-H2 then 2022-H1

Hmmm . . . maybe they said to the banks "Look, we aren't profitable, we have no idea how to start turning a profit, and we already owe you money. Our only chance of paying it back is if we take over someone who can make a profit and use their money. Lend us more so we can do that!"

They might go for it--that's more or less the business model of a lot of private equity firms.

I don't think they have talked to any banks, Irata LLC who they loaned money from looks to be a holding company controlled by the CEO of Atari (Wade Rosen) so it looks like he is for some reason trying to take over the company from the other owners. And it took me until right now before I realied that Irata is atarI spelled backwards...

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Quoting: Mumrik93Where did Atari get the money to buy them? The Atari VCS was a massive failure on so many levels I have issues believing any bank would be inclined to give them a loan.

They received €12.5M from their share holders last year by way of a rights issue and got a €2.4M loan from Irata LLC, according to their latest report they are still not profitable and had a higher loss in 2022-H2 then 2022-H1

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Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedjeI bet you if there could be alt stores to snap, no one would hate it as much as they do.

Well that is the situation today but people still hate it as much as they do. Now there AFAIK does not yet exist such a store, but there _could_ do since everything needed to build it is available, it's just that no one have bothered and that is hardly Canonical:s fault.

I'd like to be proven wrong, but I'm pretty sure their backend is tied very much into their client.

The URL to the store is most likely hardcoded in the source code of snapd, but the code is open so it can be forked and so far we don't know how Canonical would treat a patch that changes that to a config value under say /etc/snap.d/.

Right, but who would want to bother when you can just use flatpak? :)

Of course, but then perhaps also at the same time stop the hate for snap? I mean that was the context, not that you had to use it ;)

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Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: slaapliedjeI bet you if there could be alt stores to snap, no one would hate it as much as they do.

Well that is the situation today but people still hate it as much as they do. Now there AFAIK does not yet exist such a store, but there _could_ do since everything needed to build it is available, it's just that no one have bothered and that is hardly Canonical:s fault.

I'd like to be proven wrong, but I'm pretty sure their backend is tied very much into their client.

The URL to the store is most likely hardcoded in the source code of snapd, but the code is open so it can be forked and so far we don't know how Canonical would treat a patch that changes that to a config value under say /etc/snap.d/.

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Quoting: slaapliedjeI bet you if there could be alt stores to snap, no one would hate it as much as they do.

Well that is the situation today but people still hate it as much as they do. Now there AFAIK does not yet exist such a store, but there _could_ do since everything needed to build it is available, it's just that no one have bothered and that is hardly Canonical:s fault.

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Quoting: SchattenspiegelSo, there is a working .deb of Steam provided by Valve and then Canonical decides, nah, that is working to well on our distribution, let's introduce additional points of failure by wrapping it into lot's of additional bubble wrap with our personal logo this totally open and free packaging standard that everyone could use if they went a little bit out of their way and accepted a few performance and efficiency regressions - on it an then ask the community - assuming said community can fit the 'improved' product's more ...chunky... dimensions into their existing gaming spaces and time schedules - to QA it because otherwise to big a task?

At first glance one might be tempted to ask: Why?
But then I remembered something that is easily forgotten these days: this is Linux! So if someone is doing to do some crazy and unnecessary Stuff - just because!- , you take a casual, fascinated glance at this marvel, offer a barely audible, but heartfelt 'Neat!' as commentary, and move on with your life.

While I am among the crowd that hates containers with a passion I must say that _if_ there ever would be a use case for containers on a desktop then a browser and a games store would be it.

A browser because it is a major target and thus benefits much from being sand-boxed, also all browsers use heavily forked dependencies so they already have to bundle all their dependencies anyway making the practical difference between a container and a .deb

And a games store have all of the above _and_ also hosts closed source, so not trusted, applications combined with the fact that those applications (aka games) don't really have to interact with the rest of the system.

The supplied .deb from Valve is also nothing else than a small script that downloads the real steam package, so it is not a .deb containing the Steam application.

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