Quoting: webcreatureThat's why S will not be a version anymore, but a mode built into any version. Ok, no one really knows what MS does, and if they will really pull that off, but it is well known they use every leverage they can find. That way they did bad buisiness as long as I can remember. Also I can remember they have a history of wanting too much at once, then row back a bit, just to try it again later.
This time they could sell S mode as a chance for end users to have more security, while leaving the possibility for "sideloading" open. Who will argue against that except for those who think this alone can cut into the future Steam marketshare. I think most of the Windows gamers will flip the switch to turn S mode off, and be happy about it. New users however won't do that so easyly. At the same time MS could argue Win32 was insecure, legacy, the old ways, while everyone is "invited" to embrace the new ways. The MS Store would be open for everyone and so forth, all in the name of security and progress. And it would be so interoperable with XBox. Maybe they present some exclusive games for Windows and XBox.. I don't know.
What I do not understand clearly: Do you think that what MS is apparently up to do is irrelevant for gaming, do you think it is not and will drive gamers away, or do you think it will just not happen?

"Ok, no one really knows what MS does, and if they will really pull that off, but it is well known they use every leverage they can find."

No, you misunderstood what I'm saying. I'm just telling you that such an act would be a very stupid business decision due to consumer factor. Unless they're hardcore Microsoft fans people would not pay for closed ecosystems. For instances, instead of paying 500 + 49$ (I don't know about the prices in US, sorry) for a fully functional lower-medium range notebook from the Vendor X, they would just buy a similar notebook from Vendor Y with FreeDOS or Windows 10 Pro for 500 total. Since majority of the third party vendors are aware that people are looking for functionality than "convenience of Microsoft Store" they will sell regular windows or not sell at all with their rigs.

The problem we're having here is that the above scenario is already a reality. Windows 10 S is not a popular choice and it will not be a popular choice in the future. That's simple as that. The only issue with this whole thing is that Microsoft is trying to rip people off by possibly making S-Mode enabled versions to be the default for "Windows as a service" in cheap rigs of notebooks, all-in-ones and especially netbooks/tablets. These devices either are not meant for gaming or are not powerful enough to game; either way they're not cost effective under many circumstances when considering the fact that there's the purpose of gaming and such devices are meant to be cheap, accessible and multi-purpose. -- Your average gamer will not buy a "PC" that doesn't support older/current titles, software and/or platforms

For the question you asked, yes such act would drive people away from Microsoft to different ecosystems or to piracy. It's quite foreseeable. Those people at Microsoft have to be a special kind of dumb to expect locking people down only to Microsoft Store, because that would be quitting the game.

-- and for that matter, I would happily not to build my stuff for Windows because they don't support my stuff to begin with. Let's see how that logic would help Microsoft in any industry. Nope.

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Quoting: webcreatureI disagree! When the propriator of the one OS that is pre-installed on almost every sold gaming ready PC, decides to pre configure this OS to a default that makes Steam incompatible, and when the user has to change that configuration against warnings that tell him this step might be dangerous, then a big percentage of mostly new users will not do that. And that will shrink the user-base potential for Steam, not actual numbers of course.
OR.. people decide to use an alternate OS instead, which I'd like very much of course.. Do you believe in it?

"pre-installed on almost every sold gaming ready PC"

That's the case, they can't do that. That's bad business. That's exactly why Windows 10 S is not the choice for gaming or production, because it's not intended to run all the games and it's not commercialised as one. Same goes for ChromeOS, Android etc. It's much like how people were asking "How the hell SteamOS will replace Windows" in the early days and got the most obvious answer: It's not intended to do that. S Mode itself is not a profitable way of selling gaming ready PCs, since consumer is not always the idiot, but it's a good way of ripping off people.

There's absolutely no possible future in which Microsoft won the gaming industry by such a move. It's just plain dumb. You can't just force an incompatible OS in a market that demands a compatible OS. That won't force people to buy things from their Stores, it will force consumer away from Microsoft and Windows. To Mac and Linux, mainly.

I'm not trying to justify their point here. Just telling people: SteamOS and Windows 10 S or Windows 10 S Mode or whatever stupid thing they could put forward has no relevance at all.

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Quoting: webcreatureS modes purpose is (at least in part) to shrink future market for third party stores like Steam and GOG. New users, who just purchased a machine with a preinstalled Windows S mode, won't change that default, because the system will tell them it's dangerous. Most of them will never even try Steam or GOG.

That intention itself is highly fantastic as you can't push a market to shrink by selling incompatible operating systems. Microsoft's intention and the purpose of S Mode is clearly rigging prices and forcing the consumer to pay an additional fee to both vendors and Microsoft so that they could have their favourite platforms and software installed on those machines. Which will eventually force consumer not to consume such devices and Microsoft will only be selling portable and/or specialist devices which is what Windows 10 S was intended for and is widely being used for as of today. Their Surface book whatever editions are competitors to Chromebooks (and Macbooks as they're too closed environments). Microsoft is making money from cloud-based services and hardware around those services.

There's no way in coming years that Microsoft can, in anyway, compete with Steam or GOG on PC. That's out of question. There's no such future unless Microsoft buys Valve. That's also a laughably distant possibility.

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Quoting: liamdaweWell, the source link also links to this post [External Link]. In there, it specifically states all versions of Windows will have the S mode. There would be no reason to add the S mode to every single version, if they weren't going to use it to start everyone off in future. It makes perfect sense that Microsoft will have S as the initial thing you see in future. If you think Microsoft wouldn't move like that, you've clearly not seen all the things they've tried in the past.

The entire point is that if Microsoft do move towards this in the desktop space, then it could be a disaster.

Edit: Spelling.

Sure, but "all versions having an S mode" (amazingly stupid naming policy by the way. go microsoft!) doesn't necessarily mean that S mode will be defaulted on all rig or mobile device purchases or will default itself on current rigs; what it really means and the later article you base your own indicates that every Windows version (as in Home and Pro) will have an S mode available.

This is a move to sell cheaper rigs and mobile devices with purchasable Windows upgrades. That's all. That's the scheme of Microsoft here, not locking down all the devices on default to UWP. That would be a very, very stupid move.

Again, this has nothing to do with SteamOS or Valve. But there's an issue here and that's consumer getting ripped off for no reason at all. This Store-locking concept might work for conceptual, specialist devices such as tablets, cloud-based netbooks and embedded systems but if they sell a product with the basis of "This is how you game!" or "Browsing freely!" then it would be not a violation of consumer rights but still be a rip-off, thus they would investigate such a thing if there would be enough complaints. I don't know how this stuff works in US.

But, let's be clear on this: These are not relevant Operating Systems and Markets.

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Quoting: liamdaweWe're a gaming site, we're talking about a specific case here of gaming in relation to Valve's store. If you read the source link, they claim to have read a leaked document talking about it. I do suggest reading the source link, which clearly states how it will be locked down to the Windows Store.

A locked-down version of Windows, can and will eat into Valve's profits and share of the market.

Even the claimant site has absolutely no mention that Microsoft is trying to default an S lock to Windows 10. The article clearly states that they're just not going to keep an additional Windows 10 S version and instead there will be Windows 10's with S lock, upgradable to Home and Pro. Which will be a complete rip-off but since they're going to sell this OS on portable devices and/or embedded systems like they're doing right now, it won't be a desktop user problem in a greater scale as it is not a desktop user problem.

A locked-down version of Windows exists already and it has very little, if not none, effect on Valve's market share in gaming industry and this is not by the scale, it's just not relevant. A locked-down device is not Valve's or GOG's market and it's not a problem because locked-down devices such as Chromebooks, Surface whatevers and many other mobile devices with mobile/embedded/stripped-down OSs exist. These things co-exist already.

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I don't use Windows for production at all but I'm going to be that guy.

I can hardly think of any cases where SteamOS and Windows 10S could be competitors in any way. SteamOS is not designed to be an everyday-usage Operating System while Windows 10S was and still is nothing more than an embedded and/or mobile Operating System that is a direct competitor to ChromeOS. SteamOS on the other hand is designed to be a multimedia system for living rooms. This comparison is like putting Android in the same basket as BSD-like PS4. They are different.

Microsoft's next step is clearly the Polaris project and it won't be locked to only UWP applications and/or only Microsoft Store applications. That would be quite absurd in any situation. That is going to be the competitor to Desktop Linux, not SteamOS. SteamOS has no competitor, it runs PC games.

Look, I don't like Windows at all. It's a fine OS but less configurable, update system is a mess and is not something I would use for my everyday tasks. But let's not compare apples and oranges here. Windows 10S highly unlikely to affect Valve's vision of Steam Machines. If they have a slightest plan in their minds about SteamOS, it would be about home entertainment of all sorts, not exclusively gaming.

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