Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: NotYourRealName

Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: NotYourRealName

Quoting: devnullThis isn't Life is Strange where left/alt left liberal correctly fits the games narrative. It's literally about battling robots.

But there is gender diversity out in the real world and (a lot of) science fiction. The maker of the original Battletech himself is heavily involved in the development of this game, so it can be as nuanced as he wants it to be. Most people have gotten over the fact that these people exist and are prevalent through our society and media. Their appearance doesn't signal that their gender identity needs to be addressed or discussed (nor encapsulate specific political leanings).

Why do we need to be constantly coddled in some white male heterosexual power fantasy? Surely that's the "agenda pushing" here as it's scope is narrower and message more specific.

See, that's the problem here though. Yes, I'm a white male. Do I think I'm special because of that? No. But I am tired of being called racist, misogynist, bigoted, etc just because I was born white and with man bits. We're now in a place in society where people are leaving open source projects because they are implementing codes of conduct which make them fear of potentially offending someone, we should probably step back for a moment and rethink what we're doing to each other. https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=LLVM-Rafael-Espindola [External Link]

It's reverse bigotry. "I'm so oppressed, white people all hate me, I'm so picked on." Face it, we're all assholes to each other. We just got to be not assholes enough so we don't kill each other.

As far as gender diversity being out there? For mankind you have Male/Female. Then Male that wants/thinks/is becoming female and you have female that wants/thinks/is becoming male. Let's just say 0 all the way to 1. It's Still binary, but with varying 0.x to 1 in between. I suggest we could just refer to each other as She/He/It. But you know that'll get shortened to SHIT. So when referring to mankind, I think I will just call them all SHITS and go on with my day. :)

I'm a white male too. No one is calling us racist, misogynistic or bigoted because of this. Whoever has (apparently) done that is guilty of being both sexist and racist. I've heard this repeatedly bought up by right wing critics who try to straw-man arguments for inclusivity.

I've heard of that open source code of conduct, and I do wonder what particular passages are so repugnant that would cause them to leave the project. I've never had any problems myself & the codes seem largely natural and sensible.

You see, it's not reverse bigotry. They want the same thing as you (i.e. not making assumptions about you based on factors they have no control over). I'm sorry you have such a depressing view on humanity. I find that people are largely helpful and understanding to one another despite the vocal minority trying to convince us otherwise.

Well, when there are companies who are hiring people because of their race or gender and not based on their skill level because 'we have too many white males here' (and yes, this is a thing that's happening apparently), it is basically bigotry, right? I believe some developers of FreeBSD left after they instituted the code of conduct as well. Forced diversity is dumb, and against anti-discriminatory laws.

A friend of mine said the company he works for had a higher management person comment that there were too many white people in the office he works at. How's that for reverse bigotry?

I'd agree with people largely being helpful and understanding. And being we're fans of gaming on Linux, we sort of know how vocal a minority can be :) Unfortunately some vocal minority groups are annoying the majority. Maybe that's the perspective of the people who game on Windows too? "We don't want those filthy Linux users playing games with us, don't port!" Or something..

Lol. Yep - that's usually the argument that I hear straight after.

It's true. There is a glut of us in these professions. But that's what happens when our collective ancestors colonize lands. It usually takes GENERATIONS for other populations to adapt to that way of thinking. There's also the social engineering aspects which have influenced generations of women to keep out of our professions. It might be a bitter pill, but with the many, many privileges we enjoy compared to other groups, I'm prepared to do my bit. If we don't, then we'd end up in segregation, which would suck more for all of us. It's also an issue that's over-represented by the right wing. There was a poll at one stage with people desperate to get stories of people who'd lost their job to a less qualified minority (and they couldn't get any). At the end of the day, it depends on whether you're an altruistic individual.

I also really don't understand that FreeBSD thing. What bit are they particularly offended by that would cause them to leave? It'd be great if we could "keep politics out of it", but then some bad apple is going to do something stupid which ends up making someone's life hell. Is it worth taking away all the protections against harassment because a few people have a persecution complex? That they *might* be accused of having bad conduct? And people call us snowflakes... :huh:

Yeah, I agree. I suppose that Linux desktop users would be the proportionate equivalent of transsexuals? (I think non-heterosexual is way too high at 12%). The non-inclusive argument for Battletech would be the equivalent of a small group of Windows users not wanting a Linux port because they're worried about what people would think about Windows? lol. Maybe that similie needs some work ;) (and it's a poor comparison as we all have a choice in our operating systems :P )

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"... and combat logic...."
Some delicious wordplay there XD

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Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: NotYourRealName

Quoting: devnullThis isn't Life is Strange where left/alt left liberal correctly fits the games narrative. It's literally about battling robots.

But there is gender diversity out in the real world and (a lot of) science fiction. The maker of the original Battletech himself is heavily involved in the development of this game, so it can be as nuanced as he wants it to be. Most people have gotten over the fact that these people exist and are prevalent through our society and media. Their appearance doesn't signal that their gender identity needs to be addressed or discussed (nor encapsulate specific political leanings).

Why do we need to be constantly coddled in some white male heterosexual power fantasy? Surely that's the "agenda pushing" here as it's scope is narrower and message more specific.

See, that's the problem here though. Yes, I'm a white male. Do I think I'm special because of that? No. But I am tired of being called racist, misogynist, bigoted, etc just because I was born white and with man bits. We're now in a place in society where people are leaving open source projects because they are implementing codes of conduct which make them fear of potentially offending someone, we should probably step back for a moment and rethink what we're doing to each other. https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=LLVM-Rafael-Espindola [External Link]

It's reverse bigotry. "I'm so oppressed, white people all hate me, I'm so picked on." Face it, we're all assholes to each other. We just got to be not assholes enough so we don't kill each other.

As far as gender diversity being out there? For mankind you have Male/Female. Then Male that wants/thinks/is becoming female and you have female that wants/thinks/is becoming male. Let's just say 0 all the way to 1. It's Still binary, but with varying 0.x to 1 in between. I suggest we could just refer to each other as She/He/It. But you know that'll get shortened to SHIT. So when referring to mankind, I think I will just call them all SHITS and go on with my day. :)

I'm a white male too. No one is calling us racist, misogynistic or bigoted because of this. Whoever has (apparently) done that is guilty of being both sexist and racist. I've heard this repeatedly bought up by right wing critics who try to straw-man arguments for inclusivity.

I've heard of that open source code of conduct, and I do wonder what particular passages are so repugnant that would cause them to leave the project. I've never had any problems myself & the codes seem largely natural and sensible.

You see, it's not reverse bigotry. They want the same thing as you (i.e. not making assumptions about you based on factors they have no control over). I'm sorry you have such a depressing view on humanity. I find that people are largely helpful and understanding to one another despite the vocal minority trying to convince us otherwise.

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Quoting: devnullThis isn't Life is Strange where left/alt left liberal correctly fits the games narrative. It's literally about battling robots.

But there is gender diversity out in the real world and (a lot of) science fiction. The maker of the original Battletech himself is heavily involved in the development of this game, so it can be as nuanced as he wants it to be. Most people have gotten over the fact that these people exist and are prevalent through our society and media. Their appearance doesn't signal that their gender identity needs to be addressed or discussed (nor encapsulate specific political leanings).

Why do we need to be constantly coddled in some white male heterosexual power fantasy? Surely that's the "agenda pushing" here as it's scope is narrower and message more specific.

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I do find it hilarious that people take issue with the whole pronoun thing. Battletech is a universe where giant robots are able to walk around and not fall through the ground. Considering the rich history of science fiction, how is it that gender diversity is still an issue today? Gender diversity is prevalent throughout the various species on our planet (as discussed in the previous dissertations), what is the issue? No one is forcing you to play a non-binary character - it is entirely OPTIONAL.

That people decry this somehow impacts their "free speech" is the most ridiculous argument I have heard. No one is threatening free speech here. Indeed, you can release your own game showcasing as little or as much diversity as you want. Games featuring aesthetically pleasing heterosexual white men aren't going anywhere. That people feel threatened on this issue shows how incredibly thin skinned they must be.

It's no skin off my nose if I'm able to pick a non-binary character. It's nice to have more options. If this helps people who identify in that group get more immersed in the game, then all the better for them. I don't see why we need to cater for the snowflakes who preach intolerance so that we have a narrower selection. Instead of straw-manning the argument, they should take a hard look in the mirror and consider why they have gender acceptance issues.

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