Quoting: chancho_zombieEven Gabe Newell knows that DRM is a bad thing, it doesn't add anything positive. Hope one day steam makes the move of being DRM free. But let's face it DRM is still there because devs and specially companies are control freak outs, publishers and devs won't be happy if steam removes DRM.

I call bulldust on that, because not one of Valve Software's games is DRM-free, which Steam technically (though optionally) supports, as some people often point out on this site whenever the DRM argument comes up...

Quoting: psycho_driver

Quoting: CybolicEDIT: I believe most of this was sorted out with the DRM systems in place for home medias (DVDs and BluRays); ie. you bought the thing, you have the right to modify it to make sure you can actually use it.

To this day, fuck the Bluray Consortium. Its their own friggin fault Kodi w/ shady plugins is such a big thing now.

Yep.

Thankfully, it's not that difficult to get around the DRM of a Blu-Ray Disc and it's only a matter of time until the DRM of 4K Ultra HD Blu-Ray Discs is broken, too... Already specific 4K Ultra HD Blu-Ray Discs have had their DRM broken.

Quoting: WabbitSlayer

Quoting: Dribbleondo> This does make another interesting case for DRM free games outside of Steam, since a developer can't just take away your ability to play it. While a DRM free store could remove the game from you, you're still able to fully back it up yourself.

Subtle.

A drm free store took all my games away. GOG. I did a creditcard chargeback on the virtual goods I purchased. GOG closed my account.

There's two important take away points from this though:
1. You've cancelled a transaction after receiving the goods, without returning the goods; there might be more to the story, but based on what you have told us, you should be doing the digital equivalent of "returning the goods" and deleting any copies of the game you have;
2. There was nothing to stop you backing-up the game offline, so that you could still play the game should such a thing like this occur...

Anyway with regards to the article, this should not be an option for developers as many have pointed out... Sure, there are certain niche user cases where this might be justified (e.g. stolen credit cards), but Valve Software should change their policies and only allow themselves to do such a thing or put tighter controls on a developer's ability to revoke keys (e.g. all revoked keys are subject to review by Valve Software and/or only beta/testing/etc keys can be revoked, not "full" keys).

I should point out one rather important fact though (and one that applies to most digital stores) - my understanding is that via Steam, you are only buying the right to play the game, not the actual game itself... Therefore according to their terms, you technically don't "own" the game.

I personally don't agree with that stance, which is why I prefer to buy my games DRM-free and when I reluctantly buy something protected by DRM (comics, Blu-Ray Discs, eBooks, CDs), I immediately strip the DRM from it (if I cannot remove the DRM, I usually skip that purchase, and move onto something else)... But the point remains - most digital stores technically license the right to use the game to you, not ownership of the game itself.

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Quoting: DuncI can't help wondering if the survey window is appearing underneath the main Steam window for some people and they just don't notice it. I don't like to cast aspersions on fellow GoLers' window management skills, but it's surely a possibility. And if it is the case, it's something Valve should fix.

I'd agree it's plausible once, maybe even twice... But four times, across multiple computers and operating systems, with multiple users of (computer) skill levels from "highly competent" to "advanced"?

Unlikely.

Certainly plausible for some people, but not in our household...

Quoting: GuestWhat is "SurveyDateType" ? Others I've seen here are "3" ?

Yeah, I've seen a couple of different types myself... There's obviously some sort of difference, and it'd be interesting to know what that is.

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: Cyba.Cowboy~/.local/share/Steam/config/config.vdf

Search the file for the term "SurveyDate" and supposedly that's the last time the survey was run... But as I said, it claims on our computers it has been run, when in reality it has not.

Hm. Mine is under ~/.steam/steam/config/config.vdf
It contains...

"SurveyDateVersion" "3298391255500592656"
"SurveyDate" "2018-02-22"
"SurveyDateType" "2"

I seem to have the file at both locations - but based off the supposed survey information, it might have the same contents in each...

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: Cyba.CowboyThe "survey" file (which indicates the date the survey was last supposedly run) seems to think that three of the different computers running various versions of Ubuntu in our house and used by different people have all had the survey in the last twelve months, when in reality, none of us have... That would be Valve Software claiming to query me, when it has not in fact done so.

I don't know anything about a Steam survey file... What does it say; where do I find it? I guess it's undocumented (IMHO the biggest problem about the Steam survey)?

~/.local/share/Steam/config/config.vdf

Search the file for the term "SurveyDate" and supposedly that's the last time the survey was run... But as I said, it claims on our computers it has been run, when in reality it has not.

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Quoting: EikeDo you have data about these wildly differing results? These are for the next state elections here (Bavaria)...
http://www.wahlrecht.de/umfragen/landtage/bayern.htm [External Link]

I have no idea how the political system works over there and to be honest, I don't really understand too much about our (Australian) political system (only the American system makes sense to me, for unimportant reasons)... But I do know that in Australia, when they publish their polls in the news every week or every time a politician does something "newsworthy", you'll see wildly different results depending on which company the news is using for their source.

Maybe it's different in your country, but that's how it is here in Australia and that was my point - the Steam survey is similar in the sense that one should take its findings with a grain of salt, for a laundry list of reasons (one of which being the well-publicised Linux bug)

Quoting: EikeI don't understand your last phrase... Did anybody claim Steam polls are querying every user?!?

The "survey" file (which indicates the date the survey was last supposedly run) seems to think that three of the different computers running various versions of Ubuntu in our house and used by different people have all had the survey in the last twelve months, when in reality, none of us have... That would be Valve Software claiming to query me, when it has not in fact done so.

And no it's not "user error" (e.g. accidentally closing the survey) - we have a limited number of computers in the house running an Apple mac OS or Microsoft Windows-based operating system, all of which have been able to complete the survey just fine...

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Quoting: SolitaryValve is most likely doing proper QA on their own and it takes time.

Hopefully that is the case, because the long-term benefits will far outweigh the short-term benefits if true... My understanding however (based on something I read somewhere, can't remember where), was that Valve were using SPCR as a primary reference point.

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Quoting: BotonoskiHere's an alphabetized and less cluttered list of the games added to the whitelist:
AdVenture Communist
AFTERGRINDER
Bejeweled® 3
Castle Crashers®
Cat Goes Fishing
Coffee Shop Tycoon
Coloring Pixels
Commander Keen
Everyday Shooter
Fieldrunners 2
Guacamelee! 2
Heretic: Shadow of the Serpent Riders
HeXen: Beyond Heretic
HeXen: Deathkings of the Dark Citadel
Mighty Switch Force! Hyper Drive Edition
Monkey Island™ 2 Special Edition: LeChuck’s Revenge™
Mugsters
Overcooked
Puzzle Agent
Sam & Max 101: Culture Shock
Sam & Max 102: Situation: Comedy
Sam & Max 103: The Mole
Sam & Max 104: Abe Lincoln Must Die!
Sam & Max 105: Reality 2.0
Sam & Max 106: Bright Side of the Moon
Sam & Max 201: Ice Station Santa
Sam & Max 202: Moai Better Blues
Sam & Max 203: Night of the Raving Dead
Sam & Max 204: Chariots of the Dogs
Sam & Max 205: What's New Beelzebub?
Sam & Max 301: The Penal Zone
Sam & Max 302: The Tomb of Sammun-Mak
Sam & Max 303: They Stole Max's Brain!
Sam & Max 304: Beyond the Alley of the Dolls
Sam & Max 305: The City That Dares Not Sleep
Spelunky
Stick Fight: The Game
The Witness
VirtuaCreature
Wolfenstein: The Old Blood
Zen of Sudoku

So in other words, if you're not a Sam & Max fan, it's actually a pretty small list.

Strange, considering there's apparently a lot more games which have complete "platinum" results [External Link]... I would have thought that many of those would be added to the "whitelist" in the next update.

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Quoting: EikeHow often have you been asked which party you're going to vote for lately? Still, there's quite accurate data about voting estimations.

I beg to differ, because the voting polls often vary wildly from company to company (that conducts the polls)(in Australia at least)... They are a rough guide at best - but they also do not claim that I have participated when I have not.

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Quoting: ison111I actually just got the survey today for the first time in over 2 years.

The last time I had it was approximately six years ago - back when I ran Microsoft Windows 8... Of course, if you open the survey file and check the date, it thinks I complete one at the start of this year; the same is true for the rest of the Linux computers in our house (but different dates).

Yet according to Valve, it's all a conspiracy theory, because "the survey works as designed".

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If only they'd fix the damn survey bug... You know, the one that doesn't exist.

*Rolls eyes*

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