Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: MaelraneAs I said, nvidia is currently not an option as I do not plan to use proprietary drivers. If gaming would be my only concern I'd just boot up windows, really. That would be much less of a problem and currently I'd rather support Microsoft than nvidia :p

Frankly, you're making less and less sense the more you post. "I refuse to support proprietary solutions! I'd rather use Windows!" Um, what?

Easy answer: I do not want to use proprietary software on my working system (which is Linux) because in the past that brought nothing but trouble. I'm using a rolling release distribution on the majority of my systems here and that works great for me, so I do not intend to go that proprietary road again.

Plus: On Linux I'm one of that Richard Stallman guys ;)

Also: I do not see any reasons why nvidia could not go the same road as AMD and make the base of their drivers open source. They simply not care, so I don't care for the framerate I could get with a nvidia.

tl;dr: So I'd rather boot up Windows for gaming, than pollute my working system with proprietary software/drivers.

Quoting: Mountain ManThe word "monopoly" gets thrown around way too much in situations where it's not warranted. Secondly, we could certainly blame AMD if they're forced out of the market because they failed to be competitive.

Look, I'm all for competition, and it would be great if Nvidia wasn't the only choice for Linux, but AMD needs to get their act together and actually compete!

It's one of these chicken-and-egg problems really. Because if nobody is buying AMD how can they get the money to improve at a scale where they could become a real threat to Nvidia (and Intel)?

Sadly it's not that easy. But as I said, it's an easy choice for me, as a dev, as a gamer. If nvidia is the only way to go, I'll leave that train. I will not support a monopoly (and if AMD is not supported anymore, it is a monopoly from the viewpoint of a gamer!)

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Quoting: Plintslcho

Quoting: Maelranethe power-consumption [...] when I bought my last card, nvidia had nothing to offer apart from a more costly card with less power and bigger power consumption [...]

Do you care to share some benchmarks to back that statement up? I'm curious because I have yet to see a single test where an up-to-date AMD GPU or CPU is consuming less power than a comparable nVidia GPU/Intel CPU. And that's exactly what is keeping me from switching back to AMD. Plus the fact that I haven't had any trouble whatsoever anymore with graphics card drivers since I switched to nVidia.

The bold part is where I must stop. I'm not talking about current generations. Currently nvidia would be a better bet (apart from the proprietary stuff). I'm not arguing there. My card is 4 years old now and back then, for what I use my pc and what goals I set myself, nvidia could not offer anything. If I had wanted the best of the best cards nvidia would've won back then too.

I have no problem with the nouveau drivers either, on my old notebook, but then again, I don't use that for gaming ;)

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Quoting: averyvhI have a AMD card. I was proud to support AMD, because they tend be much friendlier towards open source while everything Nvidia does is proprietary. That was more important to me than a small difference in performance. But it isn't a "small difference", AMD support on Linux is dismal. Games run better on my laptop with a Nvidia card half as powerful.

I think it is worth giving AMD until November to get things running nice on steamOS, before I turn to a proprietary (but actually working) competitor, but somehow I doubt that anything will change.

Which drivers do you use? I had nothing but trouble with the proprietary drivers from AMD but the open source ones worked great for about 9 out of 10 games in my collection.

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Quoting: Mountain Man

Quoting: MaelraneI plan(ned) to buy a new graphics card in the next months and I wanted it to be another AMD, but maybe I'm going to save that money for other stuff :)

Or just buy an Nvidia card and save yourself the needless aggravation.

Nvidia has always offered stellar Linux support and deserve our support in return. Refusing to go the Nvidia route because their drivers are closed source is like cutting off your nose to spite your face.

As I said, nvidia is currently not an option as I do not plan to use proprietary drivers. If gaming would be my only concern I'd just boot up windows, really. That would be much less of a problem and currently I'd rather support Microsoft than nvidia :p

Quoting: Mountain ManLike Liam said, it's not Nvidia's fault that AMD drivers are second rate, so why punish them?

Idk, apart from the reason I stated above... maybe the 970 lies and stuff like that. If you think things like that should be supported, great!

But don't blame AMD if Nvidia gets a monopoly and starts charging (even more) money for their graphics cards.

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Quoting: Mountain ManAMD has always had inferior drivers going all the way back to when they were called ATi. I don't know why people even bother with them. Nvidia has always been the best.

Because of the cost, the (raw) power, the power-consumption and the (open source drivers ;))... ya, today this may be different, when I bought my last card, nvidia had nothing to offer apart from a more costly card with less power and bigger power consumption that had (and I give them that) better drivers. I didn't want to wait back then and replaced my nvidia with an AMD. Apart from Dying Light and Dead Island (both on Linux) I never regretted that decision.

But, really, the driver situation is only important for Linux, because on Windows the AMD drivers are good enough. From my experience, most people who say different just repeat myths and old (but no longer valid) truths and haven't had an AMD card for many years.

I'm quite content with the open source mesa drivers and I hope that OpenGL 4 compliance will be reached soon.

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Quoting: raonlinux*snip*

Ya, I forgot to mention that... Nvidia gameworks and stuff like that makes that company highly unappealing to me.

I'm sorry I don't share the common attitude. I'm a dev first, then a gamer. I became a dev through gaming when I was younger and it was and still is an important hobby to me, but there are lines I do not want to cross.

I even have an nvidia card here, but until they change their policy I will not support them anymore.

IF AMD really goes bankrupt and no Samsung or anyone buys them, we have a monopoly.

And if history of capitalism tells us one thing, then that monopolies are really, really, really bad!

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Quoting: liamdawe

Quoting: MaelraneI must admit though: If nvidia is the only way to go I'll probably stop this hobby I've been having for more than 15 years now. (gaming) At least on the PC.

Well if you plan to do it on Consoles, Android or iOS, then you're doing exactly the same, only being locked down even further.

I'm a software engineer and (IT-)Geek myself, but no... I would stop completely. I have about 200 games in steam alone. That's more than enough for the next couple of years.

I would simple stop buying any new games.

Quoting: liamdaweIt's not Nvidia's fault that games are having issues with AMD.

Let's agree to disagree here. I'm not blaming nvidia for all the mistakes AMD made, but nvidia does use its power and money to ensure they get the best performance and that games run (better) on their hardware.

But ya, the majority of problems comes from stupid developers that do not stick to standards in any way and graphic card manufacturers that adapt their drivers to the games, when - in a perfect world - it should be the other way round.

I do hope soooooo much that Vulkan and the much thinner layer for the drivers to make this situation better.

From a software engineering point of view it's so moronic to adapt the driver to every fucking game out there, because the developers don't know shit about OpenGL and even Direct3D.

(*) I know a stuff or two about OpenGL development. I'm by no means an expert (yet) but I decided to switch my master to computer graphics instead of doing more of the (often boring) software engineering stuff. So while I have a lot to learn I got bigger insight to some code and it's disastrous to say the least.

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I hope the mouse bug is finally fixed (again). It has been plaguing me since one of the first updates, then it was fixed and then it came back.

The game is unplayable for me as it is, as I can't look around at all.

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Borderlands 2 (and TPS) doesn't officially support my AMD card and yet I'm playing that game just like in windows, with the major exception that I run the open source drivers.

I will definitely give this a try, if it doesn't use advanced OpenGL 4+ features that are not yet available in mesa.

I must admit though: If nvidia is the only way to go I'll probably stop this hobby I've been having for more than 15 years now. (gaming) At least on the PC.

As I do not use proprietary technology on my Linux-machines Nvidia is no option for me (as nouveau sadly is not on par with the open source AMD driver)

While I do maintain one Windows 10 partition for testing purposes I do not plan to buy games that only run on Windows and/or Nvidia.

I've had many graphicscards in the past and I've never been a fanboy of any manufacturer.

That being said, I do not forget. I do not forget PhysX that is proprietary bullshit that is crippled on non-nvidia-hardware, I do not forget the 970 scandal, I do not forget that AMD supports and embraces Open Source while Nvidia sees it as a hindrance of their profit.

I plan(ned) to buy a new graphics card in the next months and I wanted it to be another AMD, but maybe I'm going to save that money for other stuff :)

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This is the first sale in many, many years (been an *active* member of steam since 2004) that I didn't buy anything yet. There are just a few games I'm really interested in at the moment and for some I'll have to wait until they are ported (hurry up, Feral, I'm waiting!)

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