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OS Upgrades: Why did Linux get it right?
slaapliedje commented on 1 December 2017 at 6:13 am UTC

A few weeks ago I decided to take the plunge and upgrade my work provided Macbook to High Sierra. After battling with it for a while (apparently the dual-boot I'd put on it with Linux was annoying macOS enough that it refused to install the update, then magically it did...) I got the update started and it had to reboot into this screen which only had a progress bar and an Apple. I think it may have shown a time, but it wasn't all that accurate. It seemed to take an hour or more before I could use it again.

Earlier tonight I saw Windows 10 had some updates.. well it had an update and it was a huge one (don't even know what it did). But much like the Mac, it had to be rebooted several times after first "Downloading ##%" then "Preparing to install ##%" (why are you always preparing, just go! Ludicrous speed!) then "Installing ##%" Then I rebooted.. and it had to install as it was going down, then as it was coming up, then it rebooted again (I didn't catch it this time because Grub is set to boot into Debian), when I rebooted Debian, it again said it had to apply updates, then got to the login screen... and again "Don't turn off your computer, configuring updates" or whatever...

All this while I'm unable to use my system, about an hour and a half..

Meanwhile, if I'm upgrading from a Debian or Ubuntu release to the next one... I can run a command and STILL use my system. Up until the point I reboot for new things to be used! And then the reboot takes less than a minute.

Okay, rant over. Seriously though, you'd think they'd borrow some ideas...

tuubi commented on 1 December 2017 at 6:44 am UTC

Windows updates are horrible because Windows is a design disaster.

Mac updates are horrible because Apple thinks their users are stupid and can't be trusted to touch anything while updates are in progress. Basically they tell you to go play in your room so daddy can get his work done. (I wouldn't be surprised if their unix-like system would be technically able to do it more or less like Linux.)

crt0mega commented on 1 December 2017 at 9:38 am UTC

I'm on unstable, had a bunch (1GB+) of updates yesterday. Have been playing Prey (2017) while dpkg was installing new packages ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

slaapliedje commented on 1 December 2017 at 4:56 pm UTC

crt0megaI'm on unstable, had a bunch (1GB+) of updates yesterday. Have been playing Prey (2017) while dpkg was installing new packages ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Right? I'm on unstable as well, and with needsrestart you even get just about everything updated right away and it's smart enough not to restart gdm or whatever display manager you have so you aren't suddenly kicked out of your desktop.

I agree with Apple thinking their users are stupid. Some of them arguably are, otherwise they wouldn't try to defend things like soldered in memory. (Ha, I work with a guy who kept arguing that didn't matter, I still maintain it does.)

crt0mega commented on 1 December 2017 at 5:32 pm UTC

slaapliedjeRight? I'm on unstable as well, and with needsrestart you even get just about everything updated right away and it's smart enough not to restart gdm or whatever display manager you have so you aren't suddenly kicked out of your desktop.
Aye. That's what I call an user-friendly gaming experience

slaapliedjeSome of them arguably are, otherwise they wouldn't try to defend things like soldered in memory. (Ha, I work with a guy who kept arguing that didn't matter, I still maintain it does.)
I can't imagine how he's defending bs like that. Sure, soldered-in memory might lower production costs for Apple but there's still a whole lotta of downsides for both, the consumer and even for Apple

sr_ls_boy commented on 1 December 2017 at 5:58 pm UTC

I just had to reinstall Windows 10. Windows update would no longer update, for about 8 months now.
There were problems with a 2005 copy of MS c++ redistributable. So, some games wouldn't run, namely, the
new Homefront.

You would think a freshly installed copy of the latest version of Windows would be able to handle updating.
But that wasn't the case. This OS is so closed that the problem can't even be determined by Microsoft tech
support. No logs, no console output. Support simply quotes tips from other pages if you asked for assistance.

I use this OS as little as possible.

slaapliedje commented on 1 December 2017 at 6:04 pm UTC

crt0mega
slaapliedjeRight? I'm on unstable as well, and with needsrestart you even get just about everything updated right away and it's smart enough not to restart gdm or whatever display manager you have so you aren't suddenly kicked out of your desktop.
Aye. That's what I call an user-friendly gaming experience

slaapliedjeSome of them arguably are, otherwise they wouldn't try to defend things like soldered in memory. (Ha, I work with a guy who kept arguing that didn't matter, I still maintain it does.)
I can't imagine how he's defending bs like that. Sure, soldered-in memory might lower production costs for Apple but there's still a whole lotta of downsides for both, the consumer and even for Apple

The defense was "Who really upgrades the memory after you buy it?"

slaapliedje commented on 1 December 2017 at 6:06 pm UTC

sr_ls_boyI just had to reinstall Windows 10. Windows update would no longer update, for about 8 months now.
There were problems with a 2005 copy of MS c++ redistributable. So, some games wouldn't run, namely, the
new Homefront.

You would think a freshly installed copy of the latest version of Windows would be able to handle updating.
But that wasn't the case. This OS is so closed that the problem can't even be determined by Microsoft tech
support. No logs, no console output. Support simply quotes tips from other pages if you asked for assistance.

I use this OS as little as possible.

Seriously... I don't get how people say it's so user friendly either, and yet those same people say that Gnome-shell is hard. I don't know, I use the same method of launching things, press 'meta' key, type description and/or name and it pops up suggestions, click or select with arrows/return and done. Works on both.

macOS I have to hit Command+Space, but otherwise works in a similar fashion (except now it always seems to list something Siri can look up...)

beko commented on 1 December 2017 at 7:45 pm UTC

Gnome-Shell is hard. I started to dig into programming extenstions for it. A nightmare, I tell you o0

crt0mega commented on 1 December 2017 at 8:24 pm UTC

slaapliedjeThe defense was "Who really upgrades the memory after you buy it?"
I do!

slaapliedje commented on 1 December 2017 at 9:27 pm UTC

bekoGnome-Shell is hard. I started to dig into programming extenstions for it. A nightmare, I tell you o0

Ha, what extension are you working on? Can't say I have tried coding for it, doesn't it use javascript/css for extensions?

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