Quoting: CorbenMaybe they will allow to start the single player campaign without DAC (denuvo anti-cheat), like the Halo Master Chief Collection does. Fingers crossed.

Highly doubtful. First problem is that people may think they're talking to "Bethesda", which they're not. Bethesda Softworks is just a name that Zenimax uses to publish games and Zenimax are not really the most consumer friendly bunch. Doom is also mostly played as a single player game. There was no reason for it to be there at all, let alone the entire single player experience. So it appears that this was just Zenimax forcing on another layer of DRM.

The only hope might be that it doesn't seem to work properly for everybody on Windows either. So they might have to postpone it if it turns out to be common. But it's still Zenimax, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

Last edited by Ehvis on 15 May 2020 at 12:38 pm UTC

Seriously this kernel-mode driver thing seems horrible for gaming as you pointed out, Riot will implement it in League of Legends too, and that will prevent Linux users to play it.
But also, and especially, in privacy terms which is a true nightmare (they have control on our PC entirely and we have to trust them - said Riot for ex), but you know what? People will accept it. :(

This must be a different implementation of Denuvo than other games like MCC or BL3? Well, this is a hard pass. Since Skyrim Bethesda and Zenimax has become increasingly unfriendly and aggressive in their product offerings. For me, this foreshadows the Starfield and Elder Scrolls 6 releases - draconian drm and heavy monetization.

People aren't happy with Denuvo:

Quoting: randylThis must be a different implementation of Denuvo than other games like MCC or BL3?

It's not Denuvo Anti-Tamper (which does work after adjustmens in Proton), it's the new Denuvo Anti-Cheat.

Quoting: Corben

Quoting: randylThis must be a different implementation of Denuvo than other games like MCC or BL3?

It's not Denuvo Anti-Tamper (which does work after adjustmens in Proton), it's the new Denuvo Anti-Cheat.

Thanks for clarifying. And ugh, the anticheat bandwagon is a nightmare.

Wait - was battlemode not the 2vs1 sad excuse of a multiplayer mode that no one really played except maybe with 2 friends once or twice? why would it need anticheat? Is it an e-sport now?

DRM breaking games? Well, blimey. That is definitely a first! :D

Interesting video from Modern Vintage Gamer, but only posting it because:
https://youtu.be/NYxLBhOgwYg?t=363

Oh wow, a buddy linked me [this](https://techraptor.net/gaming/news/doom-eternals-latest-update-breaks-game):

MG: We've been tracking the Proton issue immediately after launch and are committed to delivering a fix soon. This isn't a request coming to us from a publisher or anything like that - we genuinely respect such an enthusiast community and regret introducing this incompatibility on day 1.

MG=Michail Greshishchev, Product Owner at Denuvo Anti-Cheat

Quoting: CorbenOh wow, a buddy linked me [this](https://techraptor.net/gaming/news/doom-eternals-latest-update-breaks-game):

MG: We've been tracking the Proton issue immediately after launch and are committed to delivering a fix soon. This isn't a request coming to us from a publisher or anything like that - we genuinely respect such an enthusiast community and regret introducing this incompatibility on day 1.

MG=Michail Greshishchev, Product Owner at Denuvo Anti-Cheat

Do you think he/they really care? I mean if it's the same thing as for League of Legends will have, it seems a fix is "impossible". But I hope for you guys...
At least Riot won't do anything about it apparently.

Quoting: Corben

Quoting: randylThis must be a different implementation of Denuvo than other games like MCC or BL3?

It's not Denuvo Anti-Tamper (which does work after adjustmens in Proton), it's the new Denuvo Anti-Cheat.

Thanks for the info. I was about to buy it as soon as I finished another game. It's now clearly on my do not ever buy list, they lost one sell. Too bad for them, I'll play it at a friend or I'll figure another way. New born Denuvo is so useful...

What's bugging me the most are people swallowing every shit throw at them and, worst, are asking for more, it's frightening...

IOT, Social Media, DRM everything is made to get info on the way you live, to monetize your privacy and people are blissfully smiling when their vacuum is mapping their entire home floors and sending the info somewhere on a distant server, and if it's not enough the safety of their shiny new security camera will take care of sending the info if you're there or not... And People calls you paranoïd when you try to warn them, and what's worse I sell wagon of those IOT so believe me people are hopeless.

Now this company, which has the best interest in mind toward me I'm sure ( sarcasm inside ), want to install a f**king spyware at kernel level ??? Transparent, kernel level, connected to a distant unknown server, blocking you from using your software at will, now that I think of it just lack the " Ask for bitcoin to unlock " for a nice full fledged ransomware.

Sorry for the rant, I'm pissed, they really crashed the party for me.

Quoting: TobyGornowI'll play it at a friend or I'll figure another way.

If your internet connection is capable, then Stadia might be that alternative. For me Stadia works great for example.

Quoting: Corben

Quoting: TobyGornowI'll play it at a friend or I'll figure another way.

If your internet connection is capable, then Stadia might be that alternative. For me Stadia works great for example.

Google is exactly the type of company I try to avoid. I'd rather play it on my Xbox with sub-par visuals and I won't until it goes sub 10 Euros they don't deserve my money.

Last edited by TobyGornow on 16 May 2020 at 3:53 pm UTC

Quoting: Cyril

Quoting: CorbenOh wow, a buddy linked me [this](https://techraptor.net/gaming/news/doom-eternals-latest-update-breaks-game):

MG: We've been tracking the Proton issue immediately after launch and are committed to delivering a fix soon. This isn't a request coming to us from a publisher or anything like that - we genuinely respect such an enthusiast community and regret introducing this incompatibility on day 1.

MG=Michail Greshishchev, Product Owner at Denuvo Anti-Cheat

Do you think he/they really care? I mean if it's the same thing as for League of Legends will have, it seems a fix is "impossible". But I hope for you guys...
At least Riot won't do anything about it apparently.

He cared enough to make a post. The community energy caught his attention. Do I think they'll go way out of the way to make it work with multiplayer? No, I do not. But I do think they will make it not break the single player aspect of the game. Denuvo Anti-Tamper already works reasonably well on Linux. There is no reason I have to doubt his word. Fixing single player mode doesn't break their commitment to securing multi player mode.

Community to the rescue
[Downgrader Doom Eternal](https://github.com/lpww/doomgrader)

Last edited by lordgault on 19 May 2020 at 9:49 am UTC

That's the problem with Proton and the like.

If you don't have at least a clear statement that a developer
supports running the game through Proton, you're better off
expecting that your game can break on the next update.

So you bought a game for 40+ EUR that you can't
play anymore (unless you dual boot into Windoes).
Will you get a refund? Doubt it.
There has never been a commitment of Bethesda
that they support Wine/Proton.

It's not good. A very sweet poison. Face it.
Technically a fantastic achievement.
But it's not good for the platform.

Quoting: subThat's the problem with Proton and the like.

If you don't have at least a clear statement that a developer
supports running the game through Proton, you're better off
expecting that your game can break on the next update.

This can happen (and did happen many times in the past) for native games as well. However, I do agree that the chance you get a refund if native support is dropped is significantly higher . For me, I haven't yet encountered a game I bought to play using Proton to break afterwards due to update. I'm sort of expecting this might happen with Temtem in the future, but I played the game for 50 enjoyable hours already so I certainly got my money's worth. If future update (possibly Anti Cheat inclusion) will break it, it will suck, but I will be more bummed about not being able to play the new content, but I probably won't even ask for refund, because what I played was already worth the price for me.

Quoting: subIt's not good. A very sweet poison. Face it.
Technically a fantastic achievement.
But it's not good for the platform.

Proton is good for the platform. And also, in certain aspect, it is bad for the platform. Really the best way I would describe it is, Proton is a double edged sword. It's a tool that will either make Linux as gaming platform successful, or significantly damage what it has been before Proton. Only time will tell.

My view on supporting Linux as gaming platform (graded out of 10 points for each action):

Supporting open source engine like Godot: 9/10
Supporting open source middleware: 7/10
Supporting open source games: 6/10
Buying proprietary games with Linux native version: 3/10
Buying proprietary games Proton: 2/10
Buying games which do not register as Linux sale (but playing them on Linux) : -1/10
Buying Windows games and playing them on Windows -3/10

Yeah, the risk to lose support is everywhere, and I'm totally aware of it regarding Proton.
But I'm playing now more games than ever on Linux with Proton. Chances aren't bad that devs look into it when it breaks or needs an extra fix. Some Examples are No Man's Sky and Wolcen who did special fixes for Proton. Other games like Synth Riders work via Proton since an update for the YUR plugin (fitness tracker), and the devs are happy about it.
If it works out of the box or with some tweaks, I have no issues buying those games and enjoying them on Linux.
Imho the benefit you get with Proton outperforms the problems you get through it by far.
In this special case it even seems, that Doom Eternal will work again in the future, because there is someone aware of it.
But that's just my stance, feel free to disagree ;)

If there's someone with a good connection to Valve, please propose them the following:

If a developer is releasing on Steam and provides native builds for platforms

Windows + Linux

then the cut Steam takes for publishing is reduced by a certain amount.
Always with the right to take this privilege away, if a port is crap, not maintained
or out of sync with the (most likely) main target Windows.
Otherwise, you could just release a very crappy Linux build to get an overall
cheaper Steam cut. And that way of exploiting it should be avoided upfront on all accounts.

This would be worth a try, wouldn't it?

Also, it's an investment to the Steam platform and
not so much "losing" money for Valve with a reduced cut.

The point is, it would be a clear incentive to release a (well maintained)
Linux build if the total cut gets a slight reduction and affects the many
Windows sales as well.

Last edited by sub on 19 May 2020 at 2:43 pm UTC