Interesting. I've never noticed that sort of thing with an OLED on phones before.

I don't think it is/would be the "etching". I have the OG-master pre-order Steam Deck 512GB :wub:, which of course has the etched screen also, but it LCD. I've never seen that effect on it. And I do tend to play on a lower brightness with the Deck. (probably around ~20-30% or so)

I'll have to look for it now! :shock:

Quoting: BlackBloodRumInteresting. I've never noticed that sort of thing with an OLED on phones before.

That's the thing, I have used an OLED phone, and a laptop, and the screens were always completely uniform. But on my Steam Deck this starts to be noticeable at around 40% brightness, and at 10% or below, it's basically like the image I posted.

Really don't know what to make of it, because it makes the OLED look like those cheap LCD screens with backlight bleeding all over.

Last edited by Linas on 29 Nov 2023 at 3:20 pm UTC

Sounds like you're talking about the "Mura effect". Something that is apparently common in OLED screens and is caused by the inability of pixels to display the same colour exactly the same. Usually not visible in static images, but it becomes very noticeable in slow moving pictures. I recall the PSVR2 getting some slack for it as well.

Quoting: EhvisSounds like you're talking about the "Mura effect". Something that is apparently common in OLED screens and is caused by the inability of pixels to display the same colour exactly the same.

But is this to be expected from a Steam Deck OLED, or is mine "special" somehow?

Quoting: Linas

Quoting: EhvisSounds like you're talking about the "Mura effect". Something that is apparently common in OLED screens and is caused by the inability of pixels to display the same colour exactly the same.

But is this to be expected from a Steam Deck OLED, or is mine "special" somehow?

I suppose that to some degree it is expected from every OLED display. It's there on OLED phones as well, but due to the very high DPI, it's nearly invisible. So yes, but maybe yours has it in an extreme way and an RMA is in order. No way to know unless you have something to compare it to.

On the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

Last edited by damarrin on 30 Nov 2023 at 10:23 am UTC

I don't have OLED yet, but I've seen minority of people on Reddit reporting this too.
OLED uses Samsung panels, but Limited Edition uses BOE panels and few people on Reddit say BOE has much better gray uniformity.
However, considering that only a minority of people reporting this, this makes me to believe that you might have a faulty screen and should RMA your device. Or maybe people on Reddit just think it's normal? But if it's very noticeable it probably is not. Someone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

Anyway, I'd try RMA

Quoting: satorideponSomeone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

You know what, I did think it has become less noticeable when I was playing last night. Thought I was imagining stuff, but maybe there is some "break in" period with these screens.

Quoting: damarrinOn the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

0% on the OLED is dimmer and 100% is brighter than on the LCD, so the scale is not the same, making it harder to compare.

I did play a bit of [Shotgun King](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1972440/Shotgun_King_The_Final_Checkmate/) at 0% brightness in near complete darkness last night, and it is mostly usable. Also ok for web browsing and reading.

I also encountered another issue while playing [The Walking Dead Michonne](https://store.steampowered.com/app/429570/The_Walking_Dead_Michonne__A_Telltale_Miniseries/). There was a lot of ghosting around the characters hair. You see, the main character has black hair, and if it gets dark enough that the OLED pixels are actually off, they don't seem to be able to react quickly enough when the image moves. I had to increase the brightness in-game so that it is no longer black, but slightly grey, so that the pixels stay on, and the ghosting disappeared.

In the end the image was fine, not anything to complain about. But considering that the quality of the LCD screen is already really good, has good enough contrast and uniform colors, and you don't have to fiddle with it to avoid ghosting, I'd say that the LCD is actually a better choice.

Last edited by Linas on 1 Dec 2023 at 2:27 pm UTC

Quoting: Linas

Quoting: satorideponSomeone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

You know what, I did think it has become less noticeable when I was playing last night. Thought I was imagining stuff, but maybe there is some "break in" period with these screens.

Quoting: damarrinOn the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

0% on the OLED is dimmer and 100% is brighter than on the LCD, so the scale is not the same, making it harder to compare.

I did play a bit of [Shotgun King](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1972440/Shotgun_King_The_Final_Checkmate/) at 0% brightness in near complete darkness last night, and it is mostly usable. Also ok for web browsing and reading.

I also encountered another issue while playing [The Walking Dead Michonne](https://store.steampowered.com/app/429570/The_Walking_Dead_Michonne__A_Telltale_Miniseries/). There was a lot of ghosting around the characters hair. You see, the main character has black hair, and if it gets dark enough that the OLED pixels are actually off, they don't seem to be able to react quickly enough when the image moves. I had to increase the brightness in-game so that it is no longer black, but slightly grey, so that the pixels stay on, and the ghosting disappeared.

In the end the image was fine, not anything to complain about. But considering that the quality of the LCD screen is already really good, has good enough contrast and uniform colors, and you don't have to fiddle with it to avoid ghosting, I'd say that the LCD is actually a better choice.

Unfortunately we don't get to choose if we want the better battery life. They should have an option to keep all the other updates but stick with the LCD. So we could get the 6nm chip, the antenna and wifi upgrades, the bigger battery but stick with the LCD screen.

Quoting: m2mg2

Quoting: Linas

Quoting: satorideponSomeone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

You know what, I did think it has become less noticeable when I was playing last night. Thought I was imagining stuff, but maybe there is some "break in" period with these screens.

Quoting: damarrinOn the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

0% on the OLED is dimmer and 100% is brighter than on the LCD, so the scale is not the same, making it harder to compare.

I did play a bit of [Shotgun King](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1972440/Shotgun_King_The_Final_Checkmate/) at 0% brightness in near complete darkness last night, and it is mostly usable. Also ok for web browsing and reading.

I also encountered another issue while playing [The Walking Dead Michonne](https://store.steampowered.com/app/429570/The_Walking_Dead_Michonne__A_Telltale_Miniseries/). There was a lot of ghosting around the characters hair. You see, the main character has black hair, and if it gets dark enough that the OLED pixels are actually off, they don't seem to be able to react quickly enough when the image moves. I had to increase the brightness in-game so that it is no longer black, but slightly grey, so that the pixels stay on, and the ghosting disappeared.

In the end the image was fine, not anything to complain about. But considering that the quality of the LCD screen is already really good, has good enough contrast and uniform colors, and you don't have to fiddle with it to avoid ghosting, I'd say that the LCD is actually a better choice.

Unfortunately we don't get to choose if we want the better battery life. They should have an option to keep all the other updates but stick with the LCD. So we could get the 6nm chip, the antenna and wifi upgrades, the bigger battery but stick with the LCD screen.

This should definitely be an option.

Not only that, but the LCD should be continue to be upgraded with 120hz / freesync2 and some basic HDR support.

Does it look like [this](https://gearsrealm.com/mura-effect-on-steam-deck-oled/)? I also have that but really minimal

Quoting: m2mg2

Quoting: Linas

Quoting: satorideponSomeone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

You know what, I did think it has become less noticeable when I was playing last night. Thought I was imagining stuff, but maybe there is some "break in" period with these screens.

Quoting: damarrinOn the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

0% on the OLED is dimmer and 100% is brighter than on the LCD, so the scale is not the same, making it harder to compare.

I did play a bit of [Shotgun King](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1972440/Shotgun_King_The_Final_Checkmate/) at 0% brightness in near complete darkness last night, and it is mostly usable. Also ok for web browsing and reading.

I also encountered another issue while playing [The Walking Dead Michonne](https://store.steampowered.com/app/429570/The_Walking_Dead_Michonne__A_Telltale_Miniseries/). There was a lot of ghosting around the characters hair. You see, the main character has black hair, and if it gets dark enough that the OLED pixels are actually off, they don't seem to be able to react quickly enough when the image moves. I had to increase the brightness in-game so that it is no longer black, but slightly grey, so that the pixels stay on, and the ghosting disappeared.

In the end the image was fine, not anything to complain about. But considering that the quality of the LCD screen is already really good, has good enough contrast and uniform colors, and you don't have to fiddle with it to avoid ghosting, I'd say that the LCD is actually a better choice.

Unfortunately we don't get to choose if we want the better battery life. They should have an option to keep all the other updates but stick with the LCD. So we could get the 6nm chip, the antenna and wifi upgrades, the bigger battery but stick with the LCD screen.

Specifically the bigger battery is tied to the thinner screen, so at least that's a no-go. And the improved battery life is at least partially tied to the OLED being less power hungry, so even if they managed to cram the 50 Wh battery in there, the benefits would be less than they are with the OLED.

Quoting: GlitteryDoes it look like [this](https://gearsrealm.com/mura-effect-on-steam-deck-oled/)? I also have that but really minimal

It does.

The most frustrating about this experience is that they are selling the OLED as the ultimate version. It should just be better than the LCD screen in every way. We should really not have to deal with all the caveats and finicky bits when paying for premium.

Quoting: damarrin

Quoting: m2mg2

Quoting: Linas

Quoting: satorideponSomeone also reported that they had this issue but it disappeared on it's own.

You know what, I did think it has become less noticeable when I was playing last night. Thought I was imagining stuff, but maybe there is some "break in" period with these screens.

Quoting: damarrinOn the LCD I used to run at around 30% when playing during daytime, on the OLED I had to put it up to 40%. Below that everything just becomes washed out and hard to see. So, not the same problem, but still, the screen becomes unusable below 40% brightness.

0% on the OLED is dimmer and 100% is brighter than on the LCD, so the scale is not the same, making it harder to compare.

I did play a bit of [Shotgun King](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1972440/Shotgun_King_The_Final_Checkmate/) at 0% brightness in near complete darkness last night, and it is mostly usable. Also ok for web browsing and reading.

I also encountered another issue while playing [The Walking Dead Michonne](https://store.steampowered.com/app/429570/The_Walking_Dead_Michonne__A_Telltale_Miniseries/). There was a lot of ghosting around the characters hair. You see, the main character has black hair, and if it gets dark enough that the OLED pixels are actually off, they don't seem to be able to react quickly enough when the image moves. I had to increase the brightness in-game so that it is no longer black, but slightly grey, so that the pixels stay on, and the ghosting disappeared.

In the end the image was fine, not anything to complain about. But considering that the quality of the LCD screen is already really good, has good enough contrast and uniform colors, and you don't have to fiddle with it to avoid ghosting, I'd say that the LCD is actually a better choice.

Unfortunately we don't get to choose if we want the better battery life. They should have an option to keep all the other updates but stick with the LCD. So we could get the 6nm chip, the antenna and wifi upgrades, the bigger battery but stick with the LCD screen.

Specifically the bigger battery is tied to the thinner screen, so at least that's a no-go. And the improved battery life is at least partially tied to the OLED being less power hungry, so even if they managed to cram the 50 Wh battery in there, the benefits would be less than they are with the OLED.

I had seen that but I don't know that it's 100% the only option. Newer designs tend to get better naturally. Vita went from OLED to LCD and got smaller with better battery life. I was already reading about the differences and read that LCD is often more power efficient than OLED. Can't help but think Valve could make some kind of change, even if some other small sacrifice was made (other than battery), to give us a similar LCD option. OLED does have draw backs including life span and burn in. What do we do when the only replacement screens we can get are used? Everyone is going to have burn in. I guess if they are popular enough long term, someone should keep making the screens or as technology gets better someone will make an LCD that can swap out with the OLED. We can hope

I don't usually like to buy "the latest thing" until other people have had a chance to be the guinea pigs for months to a year. it seems like hardware especially always has production/design issues that take some time to get fixed.

Quoting: NimrodXI don't usually like to buy "the latest thing" until other people have had a chance to be the guinea pigs for months to a year. it seems like hardware especially always has production/design issues that take some time to get fixed.

A lot of the weaker areas that have to be fixed with display technologies rarely are. What we have are mitigations / workarounds and some gradual improvements + tuning of firmware to a point of 'good enough' perhaps slightly different tolerances and better manufacturing technique.

essentially each display technology such as:

TV/Monitor
CRT,
Plasma,
LCD,
E-Ink,
Mini-LED LCD,
Micro-LED LCD,
OLED,
QD-OLED,
D-ILA
SXRD
DLP,
DLP-Laser

etc...

They all have strengths and weakness that are basically intrinsic. im wondering if a better LCD screen in the deck would receive praise similar to the new OLED if it was capable of decent HDR and had a better panel in general should one be released ?

Last edited by Lofty on 21 Dec 2023 at 5:13 pm UTC

Just here to say that SteamOS 3.6 have an improvements for Mura effect. You probably would want to test it out.

Quoting: satorideponJust here to say that SteamOS 3.6 have an improvements for Mura effect. You probably would want to test it out.

I did, thanks.

It does not make the display completely uniform, especially on very low brightness, but it does make a difference. But how does this even work? I thought that mura effect was caused by physical inconsistencies in brightness of OLED pixels. Does anyone have any technical details on how is this implemented?

My guess is that mura is caused by bad display calibration on factory, to mitigate this there's probably some kind of mask is created which calibrates the brightness of each pixel. But I'm absolutely not sure about this. If you know programming you can check gamescope sources to get the actual algorithm

Last edited by satoridepon on 11 May 2024 at 9:07 pm UTC

Quoting: satorideponMy guess is that mura is caused by bad display calibration on factory, to mitigate this there's probably some kind of mask is created which calibrates the brightness of each pixel. But I'm absolutely not sure about this. If you know programming you can check gamescope sources to get the actual algorithm

I think you are essentially right. I found the code here: [src/steamcompmgr.cpp](https://github.com/ValveSoftware/gamescope/blob/0dbf62aa6bddf4282e00da25e4ff53804488680f/src/steamcompmgr.cpp)

From what I can gather, it is essentially an external image (a texture) that is being overlayed over the actual image. Interestingly they seem to be doing correction for red and green channels only, but not for blue. I wonder if this image is unique to each screen, or do they have the same mura pattern?

It must also mean that if you somehow got the overlay image calibrated for your particular screen, it could produce a near perfect image. But I am maybe getting ahead of myself here.