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I bet epic or microsoft are behind so many companies suing valve, especially ms, they mhave more to lose.

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Quoting: pb

Quoting: _Mars

In 2007, PRS for Music took a Scottish car servicing company to court because the employees were allegedly "listening to the radio at work, allowing the music to be 'heard by colleagues and customers'".

From the Wikipedia page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRS_for_Music#Legal_cases

It happened in other countries, too. My hairdresser has a plaque informing that the music is only for employees and the customers ought to abstain from listening to it. That's where it's headed...

Smart 😅
In France you pay SASEM for any public diffusion and they pay the rights owners. But you have to have a public diffusion and it's clearly defined by the law.

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Quoting: Ehvis

Quoting: BloodScourgedouble-dip? 🤔

The music industry has been the front runner for double dipping for decades. And while they say it's to protect "the artists", I highly doubt that the artists would see any notable income from it.

That was a rhetorical question 😇

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Quoting: syylkBut... That music, licensed by the game devs, is not played on Steam. It's only played in the game(s) - where it's already handsomely licensed!

Valve is not letting users listen to the music besides what's already licensed within the videogame, and the users are exposed to the IP only after purchasing the game - and its musical license(s) - and paying the due to the authors, directly or indirectly.

How that claim could have merit?

You can listen to the trailers I guess.. 😑

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Quoting: BloodScourgedouble-dip? 🤔

The music industry has been the front runner for double dipping for decades. And while they say it's to protect "the artists", I highly doubt that the artists would see any notable income from it.

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Valve 1vAll they're getting a ton of XP for this.

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Quoting: syylkBut... That music, licensed by the game devs, is not played on Steam. It's only played in the game(s) - where it's already handsomely licensed!

Valve is not letting users listen to the music besides what's already licensed within the videogame, and the users are exposed to the IP only after purchasing the game - and its musical license(s) - and paying the due to the authors, directly or indirectly.

How that claim could have merit?

Steam also sells soundtracks and has a built-in music player, maybe that's what they're trying to exploit?

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Pure greed. Plain and simple. Just a bunch of copyright trolls.

Why be paid for our music once when we can bully storefronts to be paid for the exact same effort multiple times!?

I hope Valve decimate them in this case. Sincerely.

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So people having a license to use and distribute music, cannot actually distribute it unless the shop they're selling it with, also buys a license.

That's...rich. But it's also the UK, home of some of world's dumbest laws.

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Quoting: _Mars

In 2007, PRS for Music took a Scottish car servicing company to court because the employees were allegedly "listening to the radio at work, allowing the music to be 'heard by colleagues and customers'".

From the Wikipedia page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRS_for_Music#Legal_cases

It happened in other countries, too. My hairdresser has a plaque informing that the music is only for employees and the customers ought to abstain from listening to it. That's where it's headed...

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Did they also sue Epic, Apple and Google? Just asking.

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But... That music, licensed by the game devs, is not played on Steam. It's only played in the game(s) - where it's already handsomely licensed!

Valve is not letting users listen to the music besides what's already licensed within the videogame, and the users are exposed to the IP only after purchasing the game - and its musical license(s) - and paying the due to the authors, directly or indirectly.

How that claim could have merit?

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Quoting: UltraVioleti have the game on Playstation / XBox / Switch / Steam put about 100-ish hours into each platform. i love this genre but apart from this and the first game i've yet to play a better tower defence game. if anyone knows of better or just as good tower defence games i'd love to play them.

It's a different kind of TD, as you don't shape the paths, but the Kingdom Rush games are all pretty good IMHO.
They are at a reduced price on Steam right now.

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Quoting: MayeulC

Quoting: liloventWhy aren't they sueing the owners of these games, Microsoft, Take Two and Electronic Arts?

These already paid a license. They want the store to pay a license as well.

Well, Microsoft also has several stores, one in Windows and another one on XBox where it sells other games not developed or published by them. And that without talking about GamePass or their cloud services where again you can play games from other companies.

We can also talk about Sony, Nintendo, Apple or Google and their own game stores. I doubt any of them license the songs that all the games sold through their store use.

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So not only do games need their music licenses, but Valve as a store is supposed to have a license too.

I don't think they are. And Valve doesn't think they are, either. Obviously we'll see what the courts say. Licensing agencies like to do a shakedown on the off-chance.

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Quoting: liloventWhy aren't they sueing the owners of these games, Microsoft, Take Two and Electronic Arts?

Also, why isn't Epic Games and GOG sued over it, as well as all of the key vendors? Are they next in line to be sued, when Valve gives in?

This is copyrights owner right to select, who they will sue. I think MS is trying to destroy Valve/Steam. Did you remember court battle with Novel against rights to Unix?

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Copyright shit. If I have license shop with boxed games, I can sell these boxes, right?

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UK and everything is clear :D Great law :D

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In 2007, PRS for Music took a Scottish car servicing company to court because the employees were allegedly "listening to the radio at work, allowing the music to be 'heard by colleagues and customers'".

From the Wikipedia page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRS_for_Music#Legal_cases

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This is so stupid it makes my brain hurt. I tend to keep writing that phrase around here lately, yikes. So many things going on with legal stuff and politics that warrant that response.

In this case:

Great video games rely on great soundtracks, and the songwriters and creators behind them deserve to have their contribution recognised and fairly valued.

did this caveman Dan Gopal just invalidate his entire legal proceeding with that sentence?!?!?!?!? 🤣 Yes Dan, great games do rely on great soundtracks, yes Dan, they do. Yes Dan, you should absolutely have the game developers pay licenses for that music, yes Dan. You know what I didn't see anywhere in your statement Dan? Anything about a storefront Dan. Oops you forgot something Dan.

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My dream for a steam update one day (I am a simple person):

• it actually exits properly when I press "steam -> exit" and doesn't just sit there forever with a screen that says "steam is shutting down" or whatever, which makes me go to the task manager and force stop the mofo.


• a "download all" button for updates on the download screen

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Quoting: liloventWhy aren't they sueing the owners of these games, Microsoft, Take Two and Electronic Arts?

These already paid a license. They want the store to pay a license as well.

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Quoting: wytrabbitI suppose they also want DVD/Blu-ray retailers to pay them for music used in the movies and TV shows they sell?

Italy is introducing tax payments for cloud storage for that.
https://kpmg.com/us/en/taxnewsflash/news/2025/01/tnf-italy-direct-and-indirect-tax-measures-in-2025-budget-law.html

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From the PRS press release, Dan Gopal, Chief Commercial Officer, PRS for Music said:

I had read Don Copal (Manny Calavera's boss) and for a moment I thought; Ha, of course this guy is evil!

"Our members create music that enhances experiences and PRS exists to protect the value of their work with integrity, transparency, and fairness. Legal proceedings are not a step we take lightly, but when a business’s actions undermine those principles, we have a duty to act. Great video games rely on great soundtracks, and the songwriters and creators behind them deserve to have their contribution recognised and fairly valued."

"Yet we allow the likes of Spotify to barely pay artists because in reality we only care about PRS as an organization, not about the works of anyone."

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Why aren't they sueing the owners of these games, Microsoft, Take Two and Electronic Arts?

Also, why isn't Epic Games and GOG sued over it, as well as all of the key vendors? Are they next in line to be sued, when Valve gives in?

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I suppose they also want DVD/Blu-ray retailers to pay them for music used in the movies and TV shows they sell?

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Article updated with more info now I have the official PRS Press Release.

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double-dip? 🤔

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It's extortion. Plain and simple.

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Quoting: Technopeasant

Improved maps throughout the game

Oh here we go again...

They're not wrong, Sin needed polish rather badly in places, I just don't trust them to make the improvements to the design of the game if they're saying it's just some map changes. Anyone who's played the game all the way through knows that Sin gets rough and quite sloppy.

I do like Sin, though.

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