Quoting: GuestI don't understand why you guys are bashing frozenbyte for not bothering to "support" proton. That's exactly the same situation of every other game on the steamdeck, no support at all from developers and publishers.

And those games simply aren't worth very much.

Let's have some axioms that even the most cash-strapped developer will agree are true.

Axiom 1:

Spoiler, click me

A game that doesn't work at all is worth absolutely nothing. It's not worth possessing, even if they give it away for free.

This sets a floor. If your game doesn't even work in Proton, it's worth exactly £0.00.

Axiom 2:

Spoiler, click me

IF someone reports the bug to Valve, and IF Valve go through the effort of determining the cause, and IF they can persuade the developers to fix their game... eventually they might provide a fix

compared to

Before release a dev sees that an update doesn't work on one of their test targets and fixes it

One of these things is much more valuable than the other.

This starts to show a scale of value for the developer keeping their game working. If a developer makes sure that it will continue to work, that is more valuable than if they don't, and the price should reflect that.

Axiom 3:

Spoiler, click me

The game has some kind of problem, and you contact the developer about it.

The developer tells you to go stick your head in a pig.

or

The developer doesn't tell you to go stick your head in a pig.

One of these things is much more valuable than the other.

Here we see the value of having recourse. A game where the developer announces on the Store page that my platform is supported, and the requirements of that support, gives me recourse should the developer fail to deliver: I have something that I can point to when getting the refund that shows that they have specifically broken their commitment. That has value.

And, good news for developers: it's really easy to get money from me. All you have to do is

• Make a game I want to play for the platform I play games on


• Use your whole arse

Do those and I'll pay you with a smile on my face. So that establishes a ceiling: a fully-supported game is worth 100%. For others, their circumstances mean that their ceiling will be lower, but the hierarchy of value is the same.

And, hey, more good news: testing your game on as many different platforms as you can; different environments, different compilers, different schedulers and memory managers, all of that - lets you find bugs easier, faster, and more cheaply, for all of your platforms, even if you never make a single Linux sale.

For me, the tiers work out as
Doesn't work at all: 0%
Accidentally works in Proton: 10%
Deliberately works in Proton: 50%
Deliberately works on Linux: 100%

Others may be more generous, or less so.

There we have a sliding scale that gives more value to the game developer in exchange for the greater value they provide to the customer. More Tux, more bucks.

Now, just me applying the sliding scale to my purchases probably isn't going to make that much difference to a developer. Even if every Linux gamer applied the same scale, it might not make that much difference. A lot of developers are perfectly content to be at the blunt end of "no Tux, no bucks." If everyone that bought a Deck applied the scale, though, maybe that would demonstrate the correct market signals for them.

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Quoting: GuestOf course, 3k open issues on proton github say otherwise...

You know there's a compatibility report for every single game that someone's tested in Proton, right? A new issue, every one.

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Quoting: Zlopez

Quoting: CatKillerThey haven't said that they'll bother testing it in Proton themselves, nor fix their game if it doesn't work in Proton, so that's still the 10% tier of the sliding scale - assuming it ever works at all.

I would say that if this isn't issue in Proton and it's reported against Proton it will be passed by Valve to developer. Which means it will have a much bigger weight than just complains from few users on Linux. Especially with Steam Deck being a thing.

IF someone reports the bug to Valve, and IF Valve go through the effort of determining the cause, and IF they can persuade the developers to fix their game... eventually they might provide a fix

compared to

Before release a dev sees that an update doesn't work on one of their test targets and fixes it

One of these things is much more valuable than the other.

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They haven't said that they'll bother testing it in Proton themselves, nor fix their game if it doesn't work in Proton, so that's still the 10% tier of the sliding scale - assuming it ever works at all.

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Quoting: Kuduzkehpanwhat is the probabilty of steam decks' proton be the same as in desktop Steam.

It's the same.

For the last decade Valve have been working to get their business to not be dependent on Windows. If they achieve "Valve has independence from Microsoft if and only if all gamers give up their gaming rigs entirely in favour of a seven inch phablet" then... they won't really have succeeded.

They need their customers to be able to do exactly what they do now, only without Windows, just in case Windows becomes no longer an option.

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Quoting: gradyvuckovicHopefully the AntiCheat solution extends beyond just the Steam Deck, but even if it doesn't, it'll be a great step forward.

Deck-only doesn't make a lot of sense, technologically or for what Valve are trying to achieve, but I could see the anti-cheat vendors insisting on a solution that only works on Valve's Proton - signing keys or whatnot - rather than allowing it to work in upstream Wine.

Still not gonna give Garry Newman any money, mind.

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Quoting: TheRiddick

Quoting: lqe5433etc. so it should be a some amount of clicks to build the game to Linux if there will be demand for it.

Unfortunately devs I've asked don't agree. They claim games simply don't work when they try to port to Linux and need a huge amount of manual tweaking and testing which consumes a large amount of time.

lqe5433 is talking about multiplatform development, you're talking about porting after the fact. They're not the same thing.

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I wonder if the trackpads will support gestures? Motion-analogous controls like Heavy Rain, or drawing runes to cast spells, could be really cool. They'd have to be optional, of course, because people are also going to want to play those games with keyboard and mouse.

I could also see a resurgence in marble rolling games.

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Quoting: gradyvuckovic

but there is generally less demand for native titles since Valve’s launch of Proton.

Here's what I read..

How well this game runs in Proton already represents more then the amount of effort that can be justified putting into a native port for Linux right now.

If Linux had more than 0.9% market share, this wouldn't happen.

Because if Linux had more than 0.9% market share, Feral would very much so care how well their game runs on Linux, enough to want to control the experience by developing a native version and offering the best experience possible, rather than just settling for whatever works via Proton.

This doesn't harm the goal of growing the Linux marketshare, it's just an acknowledgement of how small our marketshare is.

It's passive-voice: it's not Feral's decision, they're just a contractor. Just like it wasn't their decision that Creative Assembly made it an Epic exclusive for a year, or that Creative Assembly refuse to use a library that will allow cross-platform multiplayer, or that Creative Assembly don't give them access to the games or patches in advance to have same-day releases. But they can't say, "Creative Assembly shafted us again," because, you know, they'd like more work in the future.

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Quoting: LoftyI see the same thing with the steam deck, the need for two haptics is limited.. one i can see for use as a mouse but two i don't really get..

Mostly, I suspect, because having a big chunk of blank space there on an otherwise symmetric control scheme would be weird, but you can restrict either touchpad to particular regions of the screen so you could use the left mouse just for minimaps, mini-menus, macros, and things like that, while the right mouse does right mouse things.

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