Quoting: Purple Library GuyOh, come on. We know about this particular happening because it was a famous youtuber doing a live test session. Who knows how many trees fell in the forest but nobody was making a video of them?

But it was also a somewhat freak occurrence--the package failed in such a way that doing a perfectly normal command was going to cause this (if you were somewhat overconfident in your approach). That is not normal, but non-normal things happen and this one did. The package really was that way, this was acknowledged. What do you figure, Linus bribed the packagers or the Pop!OS people to screw up the package so it would cause that error?

If you're right, this would be a testament to people's double standards. If this happens to someone unknown then the answer is "next time you should read the warnings". When it happens to someone famous: "Oh, PopOS has a bug". Add to this that System76 seems to be building a reputation of blaming others for their faults, and then you have "Oops, APT has a bug". In this case they couldn't blame a famous youtuber that could make them look like shit in front of many potential users if he wanted.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy"Potentially harmful" doesn't really sound that bad. It also sounds vague, like the kind of message you get when the computer doesn't really know just what you're doing or whether it's actually going to do anything important, but is just putting in the boilerplate because the command generally has the potential to do serious things. Especially if you come from the Windows world, where I think the OS bitches every time you do anything other than browse the web with Microsoft Edge . . .

The more I read responses like this the more I think it was intentional. There's no way no one else has had this problem in years but a famous and technically knowleadgeable youtuber doing a live test session.

To use the terminal you need to read, it's a requirement. There's no NEXT button in the terminal, and anyone blindly copying and pasting text into the terminal and foolishly using the Intro key as a NEXT button in a Windows installer is doomed. If this is a bug, we should put an agreement request before the terminal opens to free the devs from responsibility, but then the user wouldn't read it neither. Looking at this like a bug it's unsolvable.

If you read "Potentially harmful" after a long text, and you have to type "Yes, do as I say", and after having tried and failed to install a package in the standard way, you should be wary that something worth of attention is happening. You just have to read a few more lines above to better understand what's happening or stop if you have no clue. But the messages were clear even for the newest users that could read. And thinking otherwise is really believing that Linus is an idiot, that he's not.

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Quoting: scaine

Quoting: GuestValve's representative didn't actually give a preference or official stance.

I'm not arguing it was a political answer, but it was a clear preference. He stated that native support is "even better". And he's a valve rep, so I'm not sure why you wouldn't think it's an official stance.

I read it as "native is better but we don't have a strong preference for better".

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Quoting: kuhpunkt

Quoting: berarmaMaybe Valve doesn't care but users should. Proton games come without support, that means the user doesn't have any rights regarding their purchase. In case of issues the developer can answer with "no Linux, play it on Windows" and they're right. Native games are supported, you're entitled to have the game working on Linux as the developer promised and they shouldn't do anything to prevent it.

To date, no Proton game is supported. What does Valve have to say about this?

I guess that's why Valve have the "verified" thing they are now working on.

If they verify it...

And we have to see what "verified" means. It doesn't sound like full support, just a very slight level of commitment. Will we have the same level of support than other users or is it on us? Can we get stuck on an old version of the game because the last version doesn't work and the developer doesn't care?

I hope it means a lot more than "we tested the game and it sorta works."

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Maybe Valve doesn't care but users should. Proton games come without support, that means the user doesn't have any rights regarding their purchase. In case of issues the developer can answer with "no Linux, play it on Windows" and they're right. Native games are supported, you're entitled to have the game working on Linux as the developer promised and they shouldn't do anything to prevent it.

To date, no Proton game is supported. What does Valve have to say about this?

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Quoting: Liam Dawe

Quoting: berarmaThis is a distraction move. Where's the news about the Steam package being fixed and the reason it was published without being tested? Because that's the real issue.

A distraction move? No. Where's the news? This is it. I don't follow Pop for such issues personally to know if a package breaks, no one notified us, and now it's all solved so we've reported on it with details that we have.

I didn't mean a distraction move from your part but from System76. That's the news they're spreading and want everybody to talk about. They're trying to divert our attention from the real issue. I'm not blaming you, although we should try to look through the smoke curtain.

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This is a distraction move. Where's the news about the Steam package being fixed and the reason it was published without being tested? Because that's the real issue.

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Those games were already available for Linux on GoG.

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With more updates comes more testing and more breakage, but maybe they were just looking for a more up to date base to work on. They could ignore most updates from that point on.

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Possibly happening in the future:

User: I have an issue with your game on Proton/Linux/SteamOS.
Frozenbyte: Bad luck, it's an unsupported system, use Windows then.
User: But you said we should use Proton because it's better than native ports.
Frozenbyte: No, we said "you could". Proton is better because we don't know how to do proper ports, we didn't say it would work. Windows is even better, you should try it.
User: No way.
Frozenbyte: Don't buy Windows games, or buy them and try them with Proton, it's very good. And we don't owe you anything.

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