Quoting: kuhpunkt

Quoting: scaine

Quoting: kuhpunkt

Quoting: scaineThe same argument and frustration is often voiced around Play and Apple's store - they take their 30% cut but unless you magically put out the next minecraft, factorio or limbo, you're gonna languish with pitiful sales until you go out of business.

And the solution would be what? Everybody is always screaming for CoMPetItiOn... and when they have that and lose against other more popular titles, it sucks. Go figure.

The point is how they get popular. If the algorithm was fairer for new titles, then indies would have a better chance at leveraging Steam and becoming the next big thing. But since it doesn't, they never hit the front-page and the same tired (but popular) games are constantly regurgitated on the carousel and in the discovery queues.

There's also a huge amount of opacity around how that algorithm works. It used to be "okay" for indies, but a couple of years ago (maybe 2018?) it changed, and multiple indies saw their revenues destroyed. They weren't even being surfaced during sales. It put some studios out of business.

You can't force being popular. No algorithm in the world can change that. It used be be "okay" for indies, because there was less competition. Less games that would take away your attention.

Valve already tries what they can with Game Festivals and whatnot, where they highlight hundreds of games.

Do people complain about Bandcamp or iTunes or Amazon, because their unknown albums and movies aren't able to compete with Taylor Swift and Star Wars?

The algorithm did change that. It's nothing to do with competition. Sure, you can't force being popular, but even 1000 sales for an indie were important and they got those sales, year after year, sustainably. Then the algorithm changed (devs were informed by Valve that this was happening, but no details as to what it meant) and 1000+ sales turned into less than 100.

So, multiple indies reporting that their sales literally fell off a cliff, as a result of this one change.

These aren't popular games, but they're solid games that used to get exposure. Now they don't. So the 30% cut by Valve, for these devs, is particularly insulting, because Valve is adding precisely no value. Indeed, many of these indies saw (for the first time, ever, over years) greater sales via Itch, than on Steam.

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Quoting: kuhpunkt

Quoting: scaineThe same argument and frustration is often voiced around Play and Apple's store - they take their 30% cut but unless you magically put out the next minecraft, factorio or limbo, you're gonna languish with pitiful sales until you go out of business.

And the solution would be what? Everybody is always screaming for CoMPetItiOn... and when they have that and lose against other more popular titles, it sucks. Go figure.

The point is how they get popular. If the algorithm was fairer for new titles, then indies would have a better chance at leveraging Steam and becoming the next big thing. But since it doesn't, they never hit the front-page and the same tired (but popular) games are constantly regurgitated on the carousel and in the discovery queues.

There's also a huge amount of opacity around how that algorithm works. It used to be "okay" for indies, but a couple of years ago (maybe 2018?) it changed, and multiple indies saw their revenues destroyed. They weren't even being surfaced during sales. It put some studios out of business.

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I follow a lot of indies on Twitter who genuinely despise Steam. Not just for taking a 30% cut, but for taking that cut and giving almost nothing back. They argue that the lure of the biggest audience for gaming is useless when Steam's algorithms are geared to only highlight AAA or "popular" content.

The same argument and frustration is often voiced around Play and Apple's store - they take their 30% cut but unless you magically put out the next minecraft, factorio or limbo, you're gonna languish with pitiful sales until you go out of business.

So, good luck to the lawsuit. It's doomed though, for sure. I'm no lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that you have to have some fairly hard evidence that Valve actually abused their market position to suppress competition. And the clauses in question have already passed muster in other law suits... so I'm not sure the point to all this is.

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Quoting: poiuz

Quoting: scaineSteam is just a better experience for me. GOG could match it, but choose not to. So yeah. I think that's a perfectly valid opinion. Sorry (not sorry) you see it as whining.

It's not the opinion that makes it whining, it's the tone & context. We're commenting in a positive news about GOG.com. But you (not just specifically you) still have to come & point out that you think they're "terrible "supporters" of Linux". From the first 4 comments, 3 are negative.

Then you (specifically you) even fail at that but still need to come back to again point out that you think they're "terrible "supporters" of Linux".

What else am I supposed to see in those comments than whining? You don't have to like them, just don't bother people who prefer DRM free releases.

You sound as frustrated that people hold negative opinions of GOG, as I am disappointed with GOG for their attitude towards our platform. And where else to voice that disappointment if not a thread about GOG? In fact, all the more reason to point out that disappointment, given the money they're earning, reported in this very article! Because frankly, a big, big part of the reason I'm so vocal on this is simply because they could do so much more, but have clearly chosen not to.

But defend away, by all means. We all have different views here and the things that are important to me (which I outlined above) are likely not important to you. That's fine. It's just weird to be called a whiner by someone... who by that definition is also whining (about whiners)?! :smile:

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Quoting: poiuz

Quoting: CatKillerIf that's so now, then it's a recent change.

I don't know, but the version numbers match in releases from 2018.

Quoting: scaineThey're not even trying anymore.

They're not even responsible for the game! It's also available on Steam and, surprise-surprise, not available for Linux or macOS! A developer already said they could look into a Linux & macOS release in the future

Good point. My point was more that it's ridiculous to emulate Linux in Windows, in order run wine, emulating Windows again, but you're right - I made that point in the context of GOG being terrible "supporters" of Linux. I stand corrected.

Quoting: poiuzThe whining about GOG is really bugging me. If you're happy with your DRM gods & Proton then good for you. Just stop the constant complaining about GOG. That's not "ignoring GOG".

The "whining" is perfectly justified. This is a site that sings the praise of gaming on our favourite O/S, but GOG's support of that O/S is extremely lacklustre. I don't buy my games on Steam because I like DRM. I buy them there because I want the Galaxy experience - workshop mods, seamless upgrades, community engagement, integrated chat, transparent multiplayer and yes, nearly transparent Windows support via Proton. If I buy a game on GOG, meanwhile, I have to download it and install, like it's still 1998. Or use a third party launcher, I suppose.

Steam is just a better experience for me. GOG could match it, but choose not to. So yeah. I think that's a perfectly valid opinion. Sorry (not sorry) you see it as whining.

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Quoting: kon14Couldn't care less. I lost all interest in CDPR and GOG after the TW3 and Galaxy linux releases were both silently dropped.
I'd rather buy (possibly) drm'd games from Steam and support Valve's efforts in revolutionizing the platform rather than pay a single cent to a company that treats me like a second class citizen even though I'm paying just as much as everyone else.

They literally redesigned Galaxy and still ignored Linux, thus I'll ignore them, at least until they fix their mess and start supporting us properly.

I hate "liking" negative comments and rarely do it, but this sums up how I feel about GOG perfectly. Such a shame that their Linux support is so one-dimensional.

Like, Dpanter mentioned in Discord recently that GOG just released Voodoo Kid [GOG [External Link]] which is Windows only. So what's the problem? Well, it uses BoxedWine to run. BoxedWine [External Link] is a Linux emulator which runs a pre-packaged wine version. So now you have a Windows executable, running a Linux emulator, calling Wine, to run a Windows executable. And they released this marvel... only for Windows. <sigh>

They're not even trying anymore.

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Liam: Metro Exodus, rage quit Valheim, Voxel Tycoon, Valheim again

There's just no escaping it, is there? :grin:

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I keep going to buy this, then realising that it can't possibly be as immersive as 7 Days to Die. Perhaps when the multiplayer is full ironed out, I might consider it anyway, as I'm sure it's a very different "style" of game, even putting aside the isometric view vs the 3D view.

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That's incredibly cool. I suppose they'll have to factor that recognition when holding a Valve Knuckle too though, since you'll stick want to use the various capabilities of those devices, like the thumbstick, A/B buttons and sliders.

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One of the last Kickstarters I ever backed this. Absolute gem of a game, but one I almost never played because it's so geared around playing with friends. Almost like Star Trek bridge crew, but in first person. Great to see it continue its development. It's looking better than ever now.

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