Quoting: liamdaweI'm pretty awful at JavaScript, so this might be a bit hilarious to try.

Hey! Cut yourself some slack, Liam!

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Quoting: nosklo

Quoting: appetrosyanGod yes! This is great news! I hope the devs are happy with being the Blender of Game Engines (let's ignore that Blender is a game engine).

WAS. The Game Engine part was removed in Blender 2.8

Commit is here https://developer.blender.org/rB159806140fd33e6ddab951c0f6f180cfbf927d38 [External Link]

Sad, but necessary.

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Quoting: MayeulC

Quoting: appetrosyanFirst!

I feel like you didn't get the gist of it, where's your drawing? :P

Already have it. Just did the obligatory :first: bomb.

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First!

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Quoting: GuestWhat we need most is middleware using cross-platform, standard tools and APIs like Vulkan, that in the long run enable developers to put out their games on multiple platforms at a lot lower cost. That would make porting unnecessary and a thing of the past. That said, it's at this point still a long way off, as there are only a handful of the expensive games that are made with such tools, like id software or croteam games.

What we actually need, is getting that middleware off the consoles.

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Quoting: liamdaweSteam Play? There's been games others have tested, that I can't get to run at all. Again, that argument can be switched around any time based on GPU, driver, distribution and many other random factors. Just the same as I've seen games people on Windows can't run, yet work without issues for me on Linux. People will always have issues, regardless of the method, it's not a great argument either way.

I agree not a good argument. Also not what I said. I said: "Even good ports have problems", and "porting costs money and resources, that the dev will most likely not recoup". I actually first heard of Gloomhaven here, even if I bought it, no guarantee that the developer will get enough sales.

And for them, it's already an afterthought. I'll get the game if it comes to Linux. I'll buy it even if it doesn't.

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Quoting: liamdawe

Quoting: appetrosyanI would say - No. Don't port it. Judging by their attitude it's highly likely that they will drop the Linux support. Judging by the fact that they're even asking the question, they don't know how many Linux buyers they need to maintain the port. And finally, judging by the fact that they couldn't be bothered to fire up a VM to check if they can actually do it → they'd botch the port anyway.

So why bother. I have SteamPlay, I don't care if the translation was done at compile time or Run time.

Ah I see we've hit peak "Just Proton it" now.

I like a good SDL port. Very few games are good SDL ports, though. Dungeons 3 crashes on anything except the Wayland session. Deus Ex Mankind divided has weird hair issues. Overlord crashes every 30 minutes. These are huge games that had real backing and were done by professionals, and still have game-breaking bugs.

Proton? Let's see. I had a weird mouse glitch on Wayland in Doom, got fixed upstream. Homeworld Remastered crashes every time you exit the game, but not during gameplay, also fixed upstream.

If they were a AAA publisher that could hire people to do this right, I'd still have my reservations. They're small; they won't be fixing bugs, and they won't be doing this full time. Why not? For them it's not a matter of principle, if it was, such a question wouldn't have even been asked. Since they clearly don't understand what they're getting into, and will eventually drop the support anyway, why bother?

The only difference is that they'd nominally produce an ELF compliant executable that sometimes still links against Windows specific DLLs... What's the difference.

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God yes! This is great news! I hope the devs are happy with being the Blender of Game Engines (let's ignore that Blender is a game engine).

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Quoting: liamdawe

Quoting: Mountain ManHere's where I stand on this whole issue:

I'm done with begging for ports. If you release for Linux, then I will consider buying your game. If you don't, then I won't.

It's as simple as that.

I continue to be amazed at how some people think. We are and continue to be a niche platform, sometimes developers need a little push. There's a massive difference between showing support... And begging. Claiming its begging its ridiculous.

Liam, with all due respect, is it the case in this very instance? As was previously demonstrated, outperforming Proton with minimum effort is... hard. If they wanted to make a native port, they wouldn't be asking. What they're trying to gauge is how many more users will they gain out of principled Linux gamers that will buy their game just because it has native support.

That in itself seems like a good deal: we get to show that you can make extra bucks by supporting our platform, Wine becomes a bit less of a necessity and the developer gets an inch more popularity. Win Win win? NO! When they decide to drop the support because the extra sales weren't great, the popularity will go away. When the botched port comes around people will test it against Proton, see that their "native" version is worse than the automatic port, and give the developer some extra flak for that. Moreover, once the "toxic" "backlash" to them trying to do the right thing dies down, it adds to the controversies: we have only one single AAA franchise that gets ported to Linux every release: Lara Croft. The withcer 3 didn't get get a port, Shadow of War didn't either. And the problem is that the developers maintain a sour aftertaste, and don't want to venture there anymore. It's not the main reason why CDPR or WB don't ask Feral to port, but that's the main reason why a small developer might want to say — nah, I've heard those jerks can't take it.

If they needed a push, they would've released the source code to the game, asked the community for some feedback (and gotten some, I'm no game dev, but I can troubleshoot bad dependency resolution). They didn't and they won't. I have no guarantee that if they're pushed over the "edge" they'll keep the port up and running. And at this stage it's more important for people who used to port games to keep porting them, rather than inviting new ones and losing both.

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Quoting: drmothYeah please show them some support. I really am hoping this will come to Linux in native form. It's so much nicer than having to fiddle with a Proton port. FPS is really not an issue for this sort of turn based game.

What sort of fiddling are we talking about? I simply... Proton most of the time works out of the box. If it doesn't, there's a high chance that the "native" port (i.e. static ELF mapping + runtime API call translation) done via SDL won't be much better (in fact I The Witcher 2 doesn't really run all that well, so a basic configuration of Proton does the trick).

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