Quoting: Fenix2412

Quoting: jarhead_hCurrently still running a Phenom II, I am planning a Ryzen 2 2700x build in two phases. Phase 1 will include CPU, mobo, DD4, PSU, 1TB NVME drive. I will be cannibalizing my existing second-choice 1060GTX (I wanted an RX580, thanks crypto-miners) out of the machine I'm using to type this post and drive the Sceptre 32in 1080p 60hz tv it's plugged into....

RX 580 pricing is still shit for you? I'm living in Poland and the RX 580 is basically back at the price where it was before this whole "crypto explosion"

No, but my Phenom II mobo has AMD onboard graphics so there's really no point in buying another card when I already have a working 1060 6GB. I wasn't even planning on buying the 1060, but a year ago my 660 WindforceOC started crapping out. So I first dug through some reviews and quickly determined the RX580 was the card, and they were all sold out as were the RX470s they replaced. Started looking at 1060s and found an EVGA for $250. A week later it was $300. A few days after that they were gone, too. I figure this card should last me fine as long as I'm still running on a 1080p TV. When I upgrade that to something 4K I will need better. I'm hoping that Navi is really good because I want to switch back to AMD. It's been awhile.

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Quoting: adolsonOK, so now we just sit back and wait for the market share to rapidly and magically increase... Or we watch as people keep making excuses as to why they can't switch to Linux. I'm glad some of you are optimistic, but this just feels like history repeating over and over and over again. 2019, the year of the Linux desktop! For real this time!!!!

There won't be a magical year of Linux. FOSS never works that way. Just to paraphrase the Ghandi quote they have painted on the cafeteria wall at Red Hat in Raleigh, "First you're the punchline to a joke, then you're amateur hour, then they're throwing you little jobs they can't be bothered with, then world domination." There will be no flag raising. No moment of definitive victory. But you will look around and realize one day that everything just kinda works, arrives with a couple keystrokes in the command line or GUI if you prefer, and that there are a lot more Linux users than there used to be.

First it will the dual boot crowd that are still hanging onto their Windows7 partitions. Then it will be the techies that don't like being abused by Microsoft, followed by gamers that don't want to pay Redmond for another Windows version. Then it will be the passthrough crowd because that extra graphics card is expensive so they are gonna get their money's worth. The normies may someday switch along with a few Apple cultists, but by and large they will continue to use whatever happened to ship on their machine.

As for the thought that that this is somehow history repeating itself..... that's just plain wrong. What Valve is doing is simply unprecedented due to the size and scope of the venture. I've never bought into the hype about Linux exploding before because the hype was stupid before. People were never going to to switch from Windows because of a better gui or anything else they have been hyping.

The fact is that what we have now is the perfect blend of ingredients that have never before been together all in one place. All of them are required. In order, we have 1)gui based distro in the form of Ubuntu/Mint/etc where the command line is optional 2)a crossplatform API in the form of Vulkan which potentially streamlines everything to an absurd degree 3) a company with deep pockets funding development that can afford a long term project that will not see immediate returns 4)seamless integration with an existing standard such as Steam. All of this combined in one place reduces the friction needed to switch to Linux to the point that even the very reluctant will consider it, because of the last ingredient that we have in spades 5) EVERYONE HATES MICROSOFT. People love Windows, they just wish that Microsoft wasn't around to ruin it.

You see, the true beauty of all of this is that all we need to do from here is let Microsoft be Microsoft, and they will inspire people to come our way now that an escape route exists. Our real problem is that Microsoft has got to know this, and may in fact back off, taking away the pressure needed for people to make the jump.

It's not enough to have a place to go to, you have to have a place that you want to leave.

I liked Windows 7, but I never paid for it. Like I never paid for Vista or XP Pro or Win2000 or Win98. I've been looking to leave Windows behind for almost two decades and Linux has finally matured enough for me to do that in just this last year thanks to WINE+DXVK&Lutris. Now I don't even have to worry about WINE+DXVK&Lutris thanks to Steam Play, which I did NOT expect this year. I got rid of my Win7 partition months ago after not using it for several months. I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE LIKE ME.

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Quoting: ThormackMy next GPU will be AMD.

<Torvalds with finger to the other manufacturer>

Currently still running a Phenom II, I am planning a Ryzen 2 2700x build in two phases. Phase 1 will include CPU, mobo, DD4, PSU, 1TB NVME drive. I will be cannibalizing my existing second-choice 1060GTX (I wanted an RX580, thanks crypto-miners) out of the machine I'm using to type this post and drive the Sceptre 32in 1080p 60hz tv it's plugged into. Next Summer begins Phase 2, which will see hopefully an updated version of the LG 43in 4K 43UD79-B(crossing fingers on 120hz, HDR, and Freesync) and hopefully whatever Navi turns out to be. Vega is an under-performer, and I doubt switching it to 7nm is really going to help that enough to justify purchasing it.

NVIDIA's new ray tracing hardware is implemented as a PhysX-like gimmick that pretties up the game without directly affecting gameplay at the cost of killing framerate. It's the first thing every gamer is going to turn off, and it's upping the cost of the cards by $2-300. Plus it's DX12 only right now, and will be coming to Vulkan in the future. Unfortunately, as hostile as NVIDIA is to open source, their cards still work pretty well for Linux.

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Quoting: MaathI have some friends who do not like where Microsoft has gone with Window 10, and its privacy intrusion and other aspects of it. Being able to access the games they like to play in Linux might just be enough for them to switch. I'm sure there are other people thinking the same thing.

Everytime that I have ever tried to evangelize for Linux I get one of three excuses for not switching - 1) muh games. 2)muh Photoshop. 3)muh MSOffice. Wine runs all of them to some extent, but it's a real hassle even for people versed in command line fu. The real key to this is not only that Wine works better than ever and is ever improving, but that it's SEAMLESS for the normies. And as things continue to improve month after month year after year the normies will trickle over because they don't want to pay Microsoft so that Microsoft can spy on them and sell the data and don't like that Microsoft controls their computer and can often break it unintentionally.

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Quoting: Salvatos

Quoting: oldeschoolLooks likes this is happening a bunch of people have been requesting a Linux port of City of Brass; the developer finally replied with a link to the announcement of Steam Play.

On the other hand, that doesn't have to be the end of the conversation. People can try it on Proton, find out what doesn't work, and report back to the dev. Knowing that they only need to fix a few issues that can't be handled by a default compatibility layer and seeing first-hand how many users are trying to play their game, what's to say the dev won't cave in and finally put some time into making their game more compatible with Linux, even if they don't truly port it? If they do, not only is it good news for their existing players who run Linux, but it puts the OS on their mind for future releases. Even if they won't port, they might consider choices that make their games more compatible with Steam Play, such as Vulkan. The snowball effect could be interesting.

This is an opportunity for Linux gamers to advocate the platform and work hand in hand with devs.

This is something that I had considered - at what point do devs start start feeling peer pressured to help Valve fix lingering compatibility issues with Wine? I mean, I haven't seen a single UPlay title work with Steam Play. Or a 2K big release. Or a great deal of Rockstar titles(esp the newer ones). When do they start feeling eveybody's eyes on them because they are the odd ones out? Blizzard and EA have already passed on Steam, so this won't affect them, but everybody else is flat out dependent on Steam for their PC sales. Valve is not FORCING devs to do anything, but all of a sudden anybody that doesn't help Valve get a game working with this suddenly starts to look bad.

So right now they help get their stuff working with Steam Play. Down the line they include a Vulkan option for their titles where earlier that would be unthinkable.

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I don't think that Valve and AMD have some secret business arrangement. As for Valve becoming lord and master of Linux gaming, they aren't just using all open tools to accomplish it, they are sending their code back into the projects they are using, meaning GoG can do this too. Humble can do this, too. EA can do this, too. ActiBlizzard can do this, too. YOU CAN DO THIS, TOO. Valve got there first, so yep, they are going to be top dog.

Right now there IS NO LINUX MARKET worth noting. Half of a percent is nothing. Have you noticed that Valve has already said that they have no plans to incorporate any of this into their Apple storefront? Why? Answer = everyone that wants an Apple computer already has one. Their marketshare if anything is DWINDLING as their people tire of paying more for hardware they can't upgrade to run software that's also available on Windows. So if you are Valve you know the only hope you have of keeping Microsoft from forcing everybody onto some new Windows Live and off of Steam is to directly fund a competitor that can actually GROW it's marketshare. Apple doesn't want the help. Apple doesn't care, or worse, Apple has it's own plans and might work against you(Metal anyone?). So what do you do if you're Valve?

Valve is using Linux as a weapon against Microsoft. Valve wants to make and sell games, not operating systems and office productivity software. If FreeDOS, BSD, or ReactOS could do this then Valve would have gone with one of those for SteamOS. But none of them are mature enough. They CAN'T fill this role. But Linux can. In fact Linux is the ONLY OS that can do this, precisely because it's a mature OS that no one can truly control. Okay. Now they have an OS, all they needed was an API to rival DirectX because OpenGL already lost that fight repeatedly.... and thank you there's Vulkan(pray that Sony chooses it for the PS5).

You give a Windows user a computer with Mint Cinnamon on it and they are right at home. And now they have all their Windows games on Steam that install and play identically to their Windows experience(more or less). Even with the reality that maybe half the games work with Steam Play across all distros right now, it doesn't matter. As long as the situation continues to steadily improve people will start to switch knowing that there will be a future where Valve has their back, and that future means not having to deal with Microsoft or Apple.

As for the open sourcing of V-EZ and redirected target, from the description it looks like it would help out indie devs that know nothing about Vulkan, and if we know anything about AMD's software side of things, they need all the help they can get. I also cannot stress this enough, Linux's future is tied to Vulkan. We really need to realize this. Right now "Linux support" means Vulkan and no extra DR beyond Steam for WINE compatibility. All the help they can get is good.

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First week beta release, so that it works at all is awesome. If this situation hasn't changed in six months we need to be concerned. But for now :

Not Working for Me:
Far Cry 2(buggy but started on with display options set LOW. Minecraftesque foliage. Technically playable, but no.)
Far Cry 3
Batman Arkham Asylum GOTY
RWBY: Grim Eclipse(installs, boots, runs, doesn't display character models in game making it unplayable)
Alan Wake
Bioshock Remasterd
Call of Juarez Gunslinger
Deadpool
Warhammer 40K Space Marine
GUN
Strider
Transformers: Devastation
Mafia II

Working:
F.E.A.R.
Max Payne 2: The Fall of Max Payne
LEGO Batman: The Videogame(audio bug that loops five seconds of the audio track over and over)
Strike Suit Zero: Directors Cut
Sid Meier's Pirates!

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: mirowell I am not pessimistic about this, surely it will do lots and lots of good.
I am just afraid that too many people will blame "linux" for the less performance and more bugs, not understanding that this is not a native build, that there is dx->vulkan translation and .dll emulation aka at least one additional layer which makes things slower and more buggy.

That is a point, actually one of the most solid "con" points I've seen. Something like this happened with the Steam Machines only it was about bad ports.

This is why you have to enable non-whitelist games in your settings, and then it warns you that it is unsupported. Even then, there will still be a bunch of idiots that blame Linux. Certain things can't be helped, and certain bridges just have to be crossed when you get to them. But what's important right now is that Valve has sprayed some nitrous into the engine and we're just getting going.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Alm888

Quoting: stretch611Consumers are more likely to be ignorant of the lawsuit…

Precisely!

Quoting: stretch611…and even if they know about it they are more than likely to side with Valve…

Guess what will happen when Steam refuses to launch after the Windows™ Update? My bet they will run towards Microsoft® and Valve® with their sticks and stones and demands to "fix it back". And what happens next? Microsoft® won't budge and Valve will be unable to do anything.

If the US were the only significant venue that existed, you might be right. Valve would sue in the EU. And China, probably. The EU courts have a LOT more teeth with respect to this kind of anticompetitive behaviour, and would right now probably gleefully nuke MS just as a side amuse-bouche to the trade war.

Here's my thoughts - if Valve thought that Microsoft actually had a legal case that Valve couldn't handle, GabeN wouldn't have ordered real money dropped on it, for going on two years now, and currently looking to continue indefinitely. I promise you that Valve's legal people have already looked at this and cleared it.

Second, I don't think that Linux will ever overtake Windows. Never have. But I'm of the opinion that it never has to. It only has to get big enough to be a viable escape route for the select few that decide to go the more difficult route. We have a GOOD chance of overtaking Apple now. I really think we do. It will take a decade, but it will happen. Linux only has to be the second biggest and we still get the AAA titles, the creative suites, Fusion360, etc. We'll be large enough to be catered to like the Apple cult. That's all we need.

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Quoting: KetilWill it warn you about games not on the whitelist if you enable it for all titles? I expect to enable it for some not whitelisted games, but that doesn't mean I want it to list all windows games.

It won't let you install non-whitelist games unless you go to your Steam Play settings and check a box to do that. That's assuming that you've already checked the box to allow Steam to download the beta and restarted it.

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