Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: omer666So how did they run their favourite games? They started to run the Windows versions... On Wine. I'd bet they'll keep doing this with 32bits-only games.

Except that Wine relies on 32-bit libraries (and kernel support) to run 32-bit games. So if Apple will bork it in macOS, Wine won't run any 32-bit games there either if I understand correctly. So it would be some incentive for them to switch to Linux. That already in some way happened, when Apple stopped updating OpenGL there.

My mistake, you are completely right. Yet I still doubt Apple dropping 32bit would change a thing for them anyway. Soon they will be able to play the wonderful iPhone games they've been longing for, thanks to the unification of iOS and macOS apps.

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Quoting: ShmerlI'm surprised that macOS is still above Linux sales. With Apple planning to kill 32-bit support in the future, I suspect at least a portion of macOS gamers will migrate to Linux (otherwise they'll lose their 32-bit games for good).

I wouldn't take it for granted. If support for older games or software was a concern for macOS users, the switch to OS X or Intel CPUs would have driven much more users away. Instead, when something can't run any longer, Mac users tend to upgrade their hardware, or software, or both.

For example, when OS X 10.2 was released, Apple ended OS 9 support. At the time, the standard in desktop publishing was QarkXpress running on Macintosh computers. When Quark failed to deliver an OS X version, Adobe just stepped in with InDesign. People just switched to OS X + InDesign, which in most cases meant new hardware + an InDesign licence, as OS X was much more demanding than OS 9.

Another example, as a result of the abandon of Mac OS Classic emulation because of the switch to Intel, people couldn't run OS 9 games any longer. Yet, they happily bought Intel-based Mac rigs. So how did they run their favourite games? They started to run the Windows versions... On Wine. I'd bet they'll keep doing this with 32bits-only games.

Because Apple saw this strategy of endlessly breaking compatibility in order to make people upgrade more often works, they just keep doing it. It allowed them to survive as a company, as many companies never bought hardware, because their Mac just kept working great, years after years. But on the other hand it drove away a tiny bit of their user base, which includes, well, me. But that's not the case for the large majority of their user base, and when people started to buy iPhones, it even expanded some more.

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Quoting: strunkenbold

Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: strunkenboldI fear that list of bugged Mesa games is not even 50% complete.

The list is populated by volunteers specifically for the purpose of bringing more attention to these bugs. Feel free to add what's missing if you know of any games like that.

Sorry but the list is outdated and lists mainly game bugs. Also I didn't saw any dev ever reacting to that list.
Like the X3 bug, that one got even bisected, anything happend until now?
What's up with those many game related bugs? Is valve doing any work on them? Have they actually ever respond after they said "let's create a list"?
I think I'm not the only one who got the feeling that nothing happens here anymore.

We don't have your PC info, do you already run AMD mesa drivers? On what hardware?
I'm planning on switching to AMD with the next gen, and I'd be interested in that kind of details...

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Quoting: Purple Library GuyBottom line to me: Model A can be a better model, model B can be a worse model, but people using model B can still get good results sometimes and people using model A can screw it up or have insufficient resources. Open is certainly a better model for bug tracking. Employees of a company using a worse model may still be competent, committed people doing their best and manage to extract some good results.

You are completely right!

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Quoting: jens

Quoting: GuestAnyway, the point was responsiveness of bug reporting. You claimed that Mesa is superior because it's public. As i've just demonstrated, this is not necessarily true.

He wont see your point due to his unconditional love for Open Source and FOSS in general.

Let me argue that you don't see his point either just because of how you expect him to think. Just because someone has got convictions that you don't share doesn't mean he's always wrong.

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Quoting: ShmerlNo driver is bug free. Nvidia has its share of bugs, but you won't see most of them reported. The benefit of using an open driver is that bug reports are public.

Let me second that. I've been using nVidia on Linux for a pretty solid ten years now, and there's been many bugs that mostly kill the desktop experience when compared to Mesa. For example, there was that infamous repaint bug that's been driving me mad for nearly TWO YEARS.

After a year without any response from nVidia whatsoever, users were left wondering if there was only someone taking care of Linux support. After a year and a half, a ticket was filed, and I was notified by email. Six months later, they found a solution.

Now they want to push their own solution for Wayland without working on it on a regular base, so I doubt we will ever be able to run it. Come on, we barely got modesetting implemented...
And I ain't talking about the overwhelming tearing with full screen videos!

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It is Zenimax which blocks unsupported builds. That's why the "Linux doesn't pay the bill" from Carmack made me laugh at the time.

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Quoting: g000hYou mentioned Arma 3 as running on Linux, even though in the Steam Store, it is not visible as a Linux / SteamOS title. I'm quite keen to get a list of other similar titles which aren't shown as working on Linux but still work (e.g. Linux experimental betas, etc).

Quite often I buy bundles, and in some cases I'm pretty sure the game is listed as Windows-only, but there's a Linux version lurking there too, if only I knew about it! I tend not to install the Windows games in bundles, unless I really like the game or I know the game works on Linux.

A good example is Everspace, which doesn't show the Linux/SteamOS icon on Steam store, but there is a working Linux version available.

Here you are [External Link]

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Quoting: ColomboYou definitely don't, because I never claimed anything you wrote in your next paragraph.

There are many reasons why people don't trust music/film/game journalist and why the in a lot of cases, something that is bellowed by professionals is unpopular and the other way around. There is a significant reason why instead of traditional media, blogs and LP were suddenly much more popular and there was such boom.

The indisputable fact (some) journalist bended over to give game a better review (to keep publishing company on their good side) is but one of them. This is not unique to games, but to everything from music, cars, sometimes even scientific papers (since if field is small, even with double blind review, you might know who wrote the paper).

However, I never claimed that DoW III is the case.

Other causes may be that there are just too many games with similar mechanics and too little time to explore games in depth, so journalist who didn't explore game fully might have been captivated by interesting new mechanics, which might provide fun for first hour or two, but then player who plays the game more finds that said mechanics is irreversibly broken. And thus while journalist had a great fun for one or two hours, player who spend 4 might find that the game is just not worth it.

In fact, original comment about that (not mine) was about this, and you claimed that this is conspirational theory.

And yet you came in with your explanation in reaction to my comment, thus implying your point proves mine wrong.

So if you don't believe it's the case with DoW III, why would you argue at all? What is the point?

Truly yours,
The illiterate dummy.

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Quoting: Colombo

Quoting: omer666

Quoting: Colombo

Quoting: Eike"Many people talked about it." is so much more convincing...

If such magazines should exist - don't buy them. Buy quality magazines.

Because this is as old as I am.

One fast example:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-01-18-developer-admits-we-screwed-it-after-game-website-exposes-blacklist-threat [External Link]

Or here in rather... long and bit obnoxious article:
https://www.kotaku.com.au/2012/11/why-so-many-people-dont-trust-the-gaming-press/ [External Link]

TB also talked about it.

Straight from your link:

And yet, still, a lot of people bash the games press and games critics.

"I think the desire to see conspiracies and corruption in all of the gaming press is largely based on a far wider malaise in the world, of people wishing to demolish notions of expertise or more respected opinions," John Walker of Rock Paper Shotgun said to me over email. "Where once [expertise] was desired, it's now considered arrogant oppression. So when a review disagrees with a reader's strong opinion, it's much more satisfying to conclude the discrepancy is the result of corruption.

I hope you were able to read the whole article and not just cherrypick a first sentence that seems to support your opinion? Which is furthermore just a citation of some personal communication with some other journo?

Yes, I definitely know how to read ;-)

What this quotation means is that it is not because it already happened before in some cases that it is the case for all game reviews.
Moreover, there is absolutely no evidence to back this idea for DoW III, other than people's confirmation bias.

Also if you correctly read the article, it is more about "Why gamers don't trust reviewers", than "Reviewers are all liars".

Believing positive reviews for DoW III were utter lies is a biased point of view which demonstrates a closure to other opinions of the game. It equates to "this game is so bad, you've got to be under the influence of [fill in with whatever pleases you] to write something positive about it". There is no proof to back it, because you are using a shortcut in your logic.

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