Quoting: subif we would reach a much higher market share by devs just using Proton, they "learned" that it's not really worth investing additional resources in native ports and just stick with the Proton way.

This is ***quite possible***.

However, I know for a fact there will be continue to be a dearth of native linux titles without good market share. Devs and studios need incentive and it's just not going to happen without the market power.

Valve has a lot of levers to pull, and if they can get some reasonable linux market share with Deck and perhaps other systems, they will get a very big lever to yank on. I'm gonna hope for the best 🤞🏻

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Quoting: Guest

Quoting: subImho bad ports are not an argument against native versions.

It's going the way lots of us expected with Proton.
Instead of supporting games without native binaries,
fewer and fewer developers are willing to port their games.
This is a problematic dependency on Proton.

I'd rather see the awareness AND SKILLS for Linux grow in developer studios.
This is quite the opposite. :/

Valve are fully responsible for the current situation as they require every game sold on the Steam Store to have a Windows executable, as per their developer documentation.

They've pushed Proton to the point of it effectively becoming middleware.

Then of course there's Microsoft, who set the standards for gaming with DirectX and other technologies. And what happens when Microsoft make it so that Windows games APIs can no longer be translated by Proton?

Valve should be pursuing GNU+Linux native games and Vulkan, however they're the largest vendor of Windows games, so nothing will change going forward.

And then you have James Ramey, head of Codeweavers who said (on record) that Proton would pave the way for GNU+Linux native development. He has nothing to worry about though, as he's profiting from the money Valve throw at his company.

Maybe it's time to reignite the "No Tux, No Bux" movement?

That kind of strategy nets you no games on linux. The combined amount of "bux" wielded by linux users is insignificant compared to the rest of the market.

Linux needs MARKET SHARE before it will be worth a developer's time to make native linux titles. Proton is the stepping stone to break the chicken and egg catch-22 problem of no native linux titles because no linux market share, no linux market share because no native linux titles.

It is to Valve you owe gratitude for getting thousands of games playable on linux, and for growing their market share, and they've only just begun with the latter. Being a member of the Khronos group, Valve is also partially responsible for Vulkan. I cannot understand the lack of gratitude.

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Quoting: subImho bad ports are not an argument against native versions.

It's going the way lots of us expected with Proton.
Instead of supporting games without native binaries,
fewer and fewer developers are willing to port their games.
This is a problematic dependency on Proton.

I'd rather see the awareness AND SKILLS for Linux grow in developer studios.
This is quite the opposite. :/

Proton will grow the linux market share, only then will studios make more effort for native builds.

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Quoting: Liam Dawe

Quoting: wit_as_a_riddle

Quoting: Liam Dawe

Quoting: wit_as_a_riddleAny way you could check Geometry Wars 3 on Deck?

Yup sure, downloading. Keep an eye on the YouTube Channel :)

Thank you, Liam!!! :grin:

Sorry for the delay: https://youtu.be/vPLNxne8Qtk [External Link]

No trouble at all, thanks a ton!

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Yes, Your Grace is also included in this month's Choice, I've been waiting for that! Glad I didn't just pick it up in the Steam sale. Looks like a great collection this month! It's been awhile since I've seen every game with so many positive votes on Steam, no game with less than 1000 positive votes, nice to see titles that aren't quite so obscure as some of those in the past.

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This looks right up my alley, thanks for covering it. I hope it comes to fruition!

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Quoting: Philadelphus

Quoting: wit_as_a_riddle

Quoting: PhiladelphusI'm curious: have the ratings shifted to be more in line with peoples' expectations?

No, they haven't changed their criteria for rating games as Verified.

Right, I know the criteria, thanks; but I remember there was a big outcry when the Deck first came out that games which were—according to Valve's definitions—Verified or Playable still had issues like crashes, unwatchable cutscenes, etc.. Regardless of what the formal criteria say, people generally expect a Verified game to be basically flawless*. So my question was, whether or not Valve have changed the formal criteria, do they seem to have informally changed the process such that e.g. Verified games are more in line with what people expect rather than just their own criteria. (Ticktok's reply above seems to indicate, informally, that the answer might be "yes.")

*Like, the Verified criteria say nothing about stability, so a Verified game could crash every 10 minutes and still perfectly fit the criteria for being Verified; but most people would expect a Verified game not to do that.

So essentially your question is:

Is Valve lying to us?

I doubt it. Maybe some testers are bending the rules? Perhaps. Why wouldn't they just change their criteria? I don't think crashing every 10 minutes is what Valve has in mind for a great experience on Steam Deck lol.

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Hey Liam maybe you could add to your previous guide on how to use ProtonUp, a section about installing it from the Discover store? I noticed that's how you suggested installing it in your video showing Morrowind using Luxtorpeda via ProtonUp, but in your guide you suggest going to github to get it. The Discover store is way more accessible to most Deck owners I think.

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Quoting: PhiladelphusI'm curious: have the ratings shifted to be more in line with peoples' expectations?

No, they haven't changed their criteria for rating games as Verified.

They outline it here [External Link].

Here's some of the text from the above link:

Games that check these four boxes are Deck Verified.

Input
The title should have full controller support, use appropriate controller input icons, and automatically bring up the on-screen keyboard when needed.

Display
The game should support the default resolution of Steam Deck (1280x800 or 1280x720), have good default settings, and text should be legible.

Seamlessness
The title shouldn’t display any compatibility warnings, and if there’s a launcher it should be navigable with a controller.

System Support
If running through Proton, the game and all its middleware should be supported by Proton. This includes anti-cheat support.

EDIT: Further explanation of all the ratings can be found here [External Link]

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Looking forward to comments about those few games that slipped through the cracks of the verification system and somehow don't work as expected according to their rating. Best, most interesting and original sentiments, and very important to note since by all indications Valve is an evil and greedy company which lies to their customers (for profit!) at every opportunity. /s!

🤣🤣🤣 Sorry, couldn't help myself.

3500 games with console-like experience. Many more with PC-like experience. It's incredible!

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