Quoting: Beamboom

Quoting: ShabbyXYour conclusion is not correct however. None of the optimizations I or anybody else made required the game to be exclusive.

Hey, cool to hear from you!
It doesn't REQUIRE it to be, no. I am merely stating the benefit of focusing on one hardware stack, and maximise the utilisation of the chipsets and capacities therein with no consideration of other hardware configurations. And that, in effect, typically implies platform exclusivity. Or ports (a whole other chapter to discuss).

Or do you disagree with that the titles developed for one specific hardware (typically console) as a general observation outperforms the multiplats?

Well what I'm saying is that there was plenty of room for different engineers to focus on different consoles, and a sister company to focus on PC that you could have both have specially good performance on consoles and target multiple consoles and PCs.

Your argument might only hold for a studio that is really tiny, but then their games aren't heavy enough to warrant a need for such optimizations.

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Quoting: Beamboom

Quoting: Liam DaweI don't think the argument has much merit of locking to a single platform for any kind of performance benefit that you suggest. Optimization doesn't mean it needs to be exclusive. Optimization at the lower end can benefit the higher end too, and generally it does.

We do not need to think, assume, suppose or guess anything: The proof is in the pudding here. Just fire up any Playstation exclusive (of any generation really - I only have experience in PS, but I would assume it's the same on Nintendo too, maybe even Xbox), play it, then compare that to a multiplat game on PC, and do a side-by-side comparison of the hardware VS experience.

I dare say one is of a very prejudice mind if the difference does not appear as striking. The amount of performance the exclusive title is able to squeeze out of the measly 300 euro console is *ridiculous* compared with the PC that in sheer number game should run around in circles around the console.

While that same blinding difference is *not* as apparent on multiplat releases.

I mean, of all arguments AGAINST platform exclusiveness - of whom there are many and legit - I would say this is the ONE majr argument for having a game designed specifically for one hardware stack. And I honestly think it's totally fair game to admit so, while still being against exclusivity. Because the arguments against may still outweigh this advantage.

Let me explain why this argument doesn't work. FYI, I was a graphics engineer on Shadow of the Tomb Raider with a focus on PS4. You're absolutely right, knowing the exact GPU, and access to PS4 tools, I could do magic that made things faster on PS4 in a way that is unimaginable on Vulkan on desktop for example. So your assumption is correct, knowledge of hardware can lead to optimizations.

Your conclusion is not correct however. None of the optimizations I or anybody else made required the game to be exclusive. There were just #ifdefs, and the game was released on xbox and PC too.

TL;DR, optimization for specific hardware and exclusivity to said hardware are orthogonal

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Quoting: Liam Dawe

Quoting: gbudny

Quoting: TheSHEEEPIt's not that I couldn't imagine some dev that is in love with the Deck for some reason creating a game specifically made for the Deck's somewhat unique input system.
Or that Valve would fund such a thing.
Might be fun, but if that ever happens, it'll be a gigantic rarity and the dev will get a lot of flak if they don't also enable it on normal PC platforms.

I want to see bundles with games for:

- Windows/Linux/Mac
- Windows/Mac
- Windows/Linux
- Linux/Mac
etc.

Valve should stop require rights to publishing a Windows version if a company want to sell only a Linux version.

There’s been a game on Steam before that only had a Linux build. It’s not a hard requirement set by Valve. The point is: why? Exclusives are bad.

IMO, it's important to distinguish between a game running only on one platform vs being exclusive to that platform (even though _literally_ it means the same). The subtle difference is that with exclusives, the devs are contractually obliged to exclude other platforms. Otherwise if your expertise is only on platform X and you release a game only on that platform, it's not really an exclusive, it's just what was in your power to do.

So, why would I hypothetically release a game only for Linux? Because I don't have windows or mac, and I have no expertise in Android or the consoles. There's nothing wrong with that. You could wish that were not the case as a user, and ask me nicely to port my game, but you can't consider me a terrible person for it.

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Quoting: KlaasThe steam logo on the dashboard is interesting.

Does anyone know if everything is controlled by a single device or is there some kind of redundancy? Running arbitrary code on a device that is potentially able to kill someone seems like a weird choice.

I think it's pretty standard to have the car-controlling computer be separate from the entertainment computer. FWIW, all cars have this double-computer system now, there's nothing specific about tesla.

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Or just don't play this game, it's not like there is a lack of great games.

I mean, the dev didn't care to test on Linux (even if just through proton), there's an xbox login needed, and probably some of your money is going to microsoft somehow. Avoid!

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Quoting: furaxhornyx

Quoting: ShabbyX

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: LightkeySimplified Chinese users (where Linux usage is near zero)

Really, someone's gotta do something about that.

I had this idea a few years ago to make a campaign to build cheap short ads for Linux and advertise the hell out of them in China and India. You target a third of the world population with just two languages, and they are generally countries where things are cheap (including advertising).

Brains are neural networks, so you repeat "Upgrade to Linux" enough, it's gonna get learned. Unfortunately I never found the time to seriously pursue that. Wanna take up the job?

The job would be:

- (Have someone) Create a sexy website for upgradetolinux.com etc. Have it be simple, and cool, and confidence inspiring, but contentwise be essentially like, here's an ubuntu image (or something we settle on as best for general public), install it with these instructions
- Get funding (I'm sure this will be easy given the numerous Linux enthusiasts)
- Make sexy very short ads (I have a lot of ideas for these)
- Coordinate with somebody in China and India to register these ads with radios, newspapers, tvs, billboards etc (as much as funding allows)

Anyone?

You may want to be extra careful on the "sexy" parts :tongue:

"Penguin with female parts", now your day/night is ruined ;)

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Quoting: Purple Library GuyI must admit I don't think I've ever seen the feature "Battle rival garbage collectors" before.

I've unfortunately had the displeasure of fighting rival garbage collectors in university where I was forced to touch Java in a course.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: LightkeySimplified Chinese users (where Linux usage is near zero)

Really, someone's gotta do something about that.

I had this idea a few years ago to make a campaign to build cheap short ads for Linux and advertise the hell out of them in China and India. You target a third of the world population with just two languages, and they are generally countries where things are cheap (including advertising).

Brains are neural networks, so you repeat "Upgrade to Linux" enough, it's gonna get learned. Unfortunately I never found the time to seriously pursue that. Wanna take up the job?

The job would be:

- (Have someone) Create a sexy website for upgradetolinux.com etc. Have it be simple, and cool, and confidence inspiring, but contentwise be essentially like, here's an ubuntu image (or something we settle on as best for general public), install it with these instructions
- Get funding (I'm sure this will be easy given the numerous Linux enthusiasts)
- Make sexy very short ads (I have a lot of ideas for these)
- Coordinate with somebody in China and India to register these ads with radios, newspapers, tvs, billboards etc (as much as funding allows)

Anyone?

Edit: stating the obvious, but by sexy I mean "very good looking", not actually pornographic

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Quoting: const

Quoting: Geppeto35The climax may be reached in the next couples of years when 1/ microsoft will end its low-cost key politics to fight against piracy and 2/ if they really make the new incoming windows with yearly or monthly subscription, as they have begun with Office and as rumor says about this next windows '12'?

I'm so glad, I don't need Windows any more, even for work. :)
Yet there have been so many things Microsoft did that made us think people would migrate to Linux... it sadly never really happened. 3rd party support, MS Office and laziness...

And microsoft knows very well why (and reinforces it): https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vendor_lock-in#Microsoft [External Link]

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Quoting: mphuZDeckard? :whistle:

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Gaben is so overweight. At this point, my biggest fear for Linux is not the death of Linus, but the death of Gaben!

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