Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: ElectricPrism

Quoting: ShmerlWhat's the problem with strong FOSS competition?

In this case it reduces incentive for companies to natively support Linux.

Pumping as much cash into Linux supporting companies as possible is a big goal for Linux Gamers as cash is king.

I wouldn't argue with that, i.e. the fact that wrappers can have a chilling effect on making native ports. But that applies to all wrappers. By this logic you should see a problem with Feral too, since companies that use Feral's work cut costs and avoid proper native ports, using a wrapper instead. It's just cheaper for them. And on the other hand, if you are OK with some wrappers already, then you should be OK with all of them.

And see above, about what practical benefits Wine has in contrast with closed wrappers.

This is not a technical issues, I see your point in an ideal world where no money is involved. But unfortunately it's all _just_ about money. Developers and publishers need to feel that money can be earned when releasing for Linux. How should that work when Linux users would just buy the windows version anyway?

Lets say wine would aim for perfect support for Rise of the Tomb Raider. Lots of people would then buy the windows version and that in turn would mean a financial disaster for Feral once they release their version. It would be the end of all AAA gaming on Linux when even Feral can't earn money with Linux.

Quoting: ShmerlAlso, we as Linux users should support FOSS more, at least I'd expect that.

Here we disagree, I prefer to support Linux as Operation System, that includes everything that would attract more users. Non-FOSS software is part of that. Restricting everything to FOSS will never reach the masses. You will need Steam, Netflix, Spotify and the likes if you want people to step over from other OS's. Remember, all non-technical people are usually only interested in having a nice GUI and getting access to their content (pim, documents, games, music, video etc.).

Just to add for clarity: I'm not against wine. I don't use it for games, just for two other applications and I'm grateful that it works. I do however use dosbox for some older games, which is more or less the same as using wine for older games. I just don't want wine to be a competitor to the already very few gaming studios and publishers that took the risk to invest into the Linux market.

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Quoting: rafaelcgs10If Valve officially supported Wine by contributing with development and allowing to launch Windows games directly from Steam client, that would help to bring Windows gamers to Linux. I will never officially get all Windows games, so Wine is worth it.

This would eventually help a bit in the short term, but in the long term it would be very counterproductive since no gaming studio would no longer be interested to invest into Linux since they would assume that Valve alone would take care for Linux. Next to that I don't think that wine will ever reach the level where wine gaming comes close to the quality of Feral like ports.
(And I sincere hope that I'm right about this, otherwise the Linux community would shoot themselves pretty badly into their own feet when wine aims to compete with Feral etc and takes paying costumers away from them.)

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Quoting: Mohandevir

Quoting: jens

Quoting: Mohandevir

Quoting: BeamboomBah these guessing games are FUN, chepati and Mohandevir! It doesn't spoil anything. It doesn't affect any release dates. It's just for good measure.

Keep us guessing, Feral!

:)

Personnally, I don't really care but I understand Chepati's point of view. It's true that many purchases could get postponed for the official Linux release if us, dualbooting gamers, knew earlier that the game was coming.

I guess the opposite would be valid as well, lots of people would then buy the Windows version before Linux release date as soon as it is somehow on sale..

Maybe too... But at least there is GamingOnLinux to warn them not to do that. :)

I hope so, though sometimes people tend to forget their principles when it seems to concern their own wallets :)

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Quoting: qptain NemoTheir desire to buy Valve is an admission of weakness, though, which pleases me.

Actually it would a strength to know your weaknesses and act accordingly. It would be a weakness to blindly fight until the bitter end when nothing can be gained. :)

"If you can't beat them, join them"

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Quoting: Mohandevir

Quoting: BeamboomBah these guessing games are FUN, chepati and Mohandevir! It doesn't spoil anything. It doesn't affect any release dates. It's just for good measure.

Keep us guessing, Feral!

:)

Personnally, I don't really care but I understand Chepati's point of view. It's true that many purchases could get postponed for the official Linux release if us, dualbooting gamers, knew earlier that the game was coming.

I guess the opposite would be valid as well, lots of people would then buy the Windows version before Linux release date as soon as it is somehow on sale..

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: ScooptaAlthough Feral does seem to put quite a bit of work into their ports I would like more info on exactly how much wrapping vs porting they're doing.

VP and WINE are doing binary wrapping, while Feral is doing source wrapping. The first runs Windows binaries in Linux, the second creates pure ("native") Linux binaries. Do we need way more information?

Exactly.

Quoting: ScooptaYeah I'm not a huge fan of wrapping in general but all the porting companies do it to a certain extent because it's the only economical way to do it. As a result I try to minimize the games I buy from them which isn't hard. Most of the games feral has ported recently aren't games I'm really into anyway.

Please also note that, in addition to Eike's statement, there are always several layers that wrap lower layers underneath until your call reaches the hardware. In the end the result is always a native Linux process, otherwise it wouldn't start.

I get you point, but in the end it just matters if the process is stable and performs. Give it some time, I guess we will see more projects with Linux in mind from the beginning on once publishers and studios got the idea that money can be earned on Linux. Currently it is simply financially not feasible to invest the time to get all out of Linux, the small performance penalty is the price for our small market share. A price I'm happy to pay for to have at least some very cool big titles on Linux and to have a chance to attract more people for gradually grow which will hopefully increase our market share. That in turn should make heavier investments into Linux feasible. I guess you get my idea :)

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Quoting: TheRiddickIf GTA5 got a linux release, it would be earth shattering indeed, but as we have found out over the years, some developers are very hostile towards linux, even when someone else is doing most the work for them...

Do you know what "very hostile" actually means ;)? There is a big difference between that and "don't care" or "seeing no point". This "if you are not my friend then you must be my enemy" attitude really serves no one.

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Hopefully this question is again a method for Feral to create some momentum before the release of a new title, it reads very similar to the former question if Linux gamers would be interested in F1 2017 ;)

Anyway: Rise of the Tomb Raider - Having the series complete on Linux wouldn't no longer make me jealous when someone mentions how cool the complete Uncharted series is for PS3/4. Fingers crossed!

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Quoting: GuestI don't mean to veer completely off topic here, but for any of you youngers that want to see the PC gaming journey as we olders experienced it, this always gets my vote.

Thanks for the link, nice memories ;). My PC/MS DOS time starts at 10 minutes, though had a C64 before :)

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Quoting: GuestThis hearkens back to the days when some of us were playing [Indianapolis 500: The Simulation](https://www.mobygames.com/game/indianapolis-500-the-simulation) while the rest of the gaming world was in its diapers playing Super Mario Bros.

I remember this game too. Papyrus were my heroes for their car handling, good old times ;)

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