I am hoping Valve's Steam Cloud will come out soon. It will be very hard for me to use Stadia. Knowing I am paying or using a service from a company that would overthrow Linux, with their ChromeOS, and that often censors their services isn't okay with me. Valve on other hand seems to be fair. Even if you are skeptical to my "claims", you can already see Stadia is not much better than EGS in that they engage in exclusivity too. Which is a bad thing in general for gaming on PC.

I've tested Remote Play (more) and it will be a decent solution when I need to stream. That said, if Stadia's success will bring alot improvements to Linux ecosystem (particularly Desktop), then I am all for it. It's understandable to me though if anyone on Linux uses Stadia, afterall it lets you play games you couldn't otherwise and you are still using Linux for that.

EDIT: And if Google wanted positivity both for ChromeOS and Desktop Linux, they would encourage developers to not only provide their games via streaming on both platforms, but also local versions. But they aren't doing that...

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Quoting: clatterfordslimSo yeah, maybe it'll get things somewhere, maybe it won't. It may indeed end up doing more harm than good. But I don't see anything else on the horizon capable of beating certain chicken-egg problems, so thus far I'd rather see it than nothing.

Right? If Linux could or would have become popular without Proton's existance, but simply with native ports, why didn't it the last decade? I am so sure that if Proton wasn't around Linux would be seriously choked out. Xbox Game Pass, XCloud and Play anywhere from Microsoft and changes made to Windows 10 since initial period are pretty good!

Quoting: clatterfordslimSo if we really want Windows games straight from the developers, to play from release day one we who are playing their games through Proton should be getting in contact with the developers, to say hey we are able to play your game here in Linux, with better performance than in Windows. Any chance you could add some Vulkan to the code so we can have it natively? Then leave them names of Linux Porters Feral Interactive for instance. We as players of these games should be doing something too and not just leaving it to the likes of Steam, as they are working so hard already making Proton work with every game under the sun. The question is though. Would developers actually listen and take note to what Joe Bloggs has to say and ask?? But this was the whole idea of Proton anyway, however it was going to show to developers, being played on Linux?

No. I don't mean to be cynical but many developers have already made up their mind or/and are also restricted by other factors such as their employers or software licenses. It's also been said it's not the porting that's costly it is the fact you have to maintain it. What you can do is ask developers or companies that show interest, because believe me many don't care because of business (with the 1% marketshare in mind), who favor Vulkan over D3D to maybe consider porting their games. Even games that primarily uses Vulkan (DOOM) are hard to get ported to Linux because developers don't can't bother with maintaining the port after release. Even after a game has been ported to Linux you can't be certain well done or/and it will be maintained (Metro Last Light). EDIT: Indie developers are a exception. Their games are smaller in scope and they are largely independent, so I'd ask for port for such games.

What you should do is promote cross platform tech such as Vulkan. Not only is it effortless for developers, as they don't have to maintain a Linux version, but it will run close to native through Proton. I have seen numerous posts of people asking for Linux release for many, many games. Developers don't listen for whatever reason. I have strong belief that Vulkan adoption and Proton's getting better will bring many more people to Linux. Remember, a game that uses Vulkan that runs through Proton does not use DXVK nor D9VK so the code is run natively and with negligable performance penalty. Word of mouth is a powerful marketing. But as I pointed out earlier, Linux is less feasible for more people until anticheat and VK3D support is finalized.

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Quoting: EikeI understand that it's the rescue for some (many) Linux gamers. I fear that it's hindering Linux native ports (while others think it's the possibility for Linux gaming to lift of to getr more native ports). It's an astonishing piece of software for sure. So, mixed bag for me.

What I mainly wanted to say is that I don't feel it will succeed in lifting off Linux gaming, unfortunately.

Your concern is valid and rings true. But I believe Proton will do far more good than harm. Native ports (speaking of major games not indie) vs Proton is like the saying that goes something like this "Give a man a fish, and he will be fed for a day. Teach a man how to fish and he will be fed for life". Native ports won't by itself adress issue of marketshare. It's such a fickle situation that Proton is really necessary. As has been said if 10 major companies port their big games to Linux, all the money from us Linux gamers will be spread across them. And as it is, the users are so few that there is little money for them, and now with ten major games competing against eachother that money is made even less.

Don't consider Proton the end result, consider it a long term solution to ensure native ports on Linux. Proton also encourages Vulkan and Vulkan is a key players for developers to be able to port games easier and with less costs. You should still keep a healthy buying habit. If there is a game that's excellent and available natively on Linux, that you like, spend alot money on it. For Proton titles...wait for discount and spend less. I've observed alot positive things with Proton's release. Things are brewing. It has made such positive effect on my gaming experience on Linux. And Valve hasn't shown any signs of stopping with their investment in it. Stay positive:)

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Quoting: EikeTrouble is, it already is one year later and our percentage didn't budge.

There are many reasons why:
1. Proton isn't complete
1.1 It lacks anti cheat support which hinders many popular games from working.
1.2 It still is undergoing development (VK3D), further optimization and bug fixes
2. Other platforms are also improving. Windows now has Xbox Game Pass and soon it will also have XCloud. That is a compelling proposition for gamers to stay on or use Windows.
3. Linux needs marketing, it has little to no marketing.
4. Other platforms are preinstalled on PC that people buy

It isn't now you should be judging Proton harshly. You should when anti cheat support has landed and VK3D progresses as much as DXVK has.

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Proton adds to WINE. Valve isn't just forking it and keep it to themselves +1
Proton encourages Linux purchases +1
Proton enables gaming +5 (Tons games we will never see a port for)

And you read what Pierre said "At this early stage...". That makes me so pleased. There is a time and place for every points that have been made in Proton discussion. Right now Linux is gaining foothold, small as it may be.

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Keep in mind with Proton is that developers can only continue relying on it so much before they get backlash. The bigger the percentage of gamers on Linux the more noise there will be about developers who take lazy route. If Linux gets 5% share on Steam, that 5% will create alot bad PR for the company (and rightfully so if they are lazy). Just take Rocket League as example..
At certain percentage reluctant developers will be forced by marketshare to consider Linux whether they like it or not.

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Quoting: SirLootALotIf a game is developed for only one platform it is not an exclusive. It becomes exclusive at the point where an agreement is done with whoever to exclude a certain platform from development.
It is one thing to not care about a platform. Actively hindering that platform to prosper is a different thing.

Totally agree, developing for one platform is not exclusivity. That said I would wager alot that many if not all of the games in 2020 will be exclusive to Stadia because of a agreement.

Gylt Exclusivity [External Link]

Except it is not.

Eurogamer spoke to Raúl Rubio Munárriz, co-founder and creative director of Tequila Works and asked for clarification as, until way in to 2020, the only way to play Gylt is to fork out £120 on the Google Stadia Founder Edition package and that seems rather limiting.

“OK we haven’t confirmed that it’s an exclusive yet,” he said “that’s a question we cannot answer”.

Wait. What? Is it a timed exclusive?

“We haven’t answered that yet and I cannot answer yet” is the reply.

So it’s coming to other platforms?

“I cannot answer yet.” evades Munárriz. “Of course, we will try to make Gylt accessible for everyone. I guess it’s not a design question, it’s more of a business question. Today is not the time to answer that question but rest assured, everyone will be able to play the game.”

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Quoting: OrkultusSo are they planning on making these chromebooks have enough power to run games in steam?

It's possible they are trying to expand how many games can be played by allowing their Chromebook users to fallback to Steam's Remote Play service where Stadia fails.

Quoting: ShmerlIf it will help increasing the number of Linux games, then it's a good development.

My experience with Steam Remote Play and Play Together has been OK at best. Remote Play Together did not work and Remote Play image was distorted, especially when movement came into play. Perhaps the PC I used to stream to was to outdated. But I don't think Google will encourage developers to develop natively for Linux. Instead I think they will try to twine developers into ChromeOS and somehow make it different enough so that it doesn't run on Linux. Outcome can be a good thing (more work on Linux ecosystem) but it can be bad too. I don't want a third walled garden for Linux to compete against.

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Contrary to what some people think I believe Proton is the only light in the tunnel for Linux. I can't stress it enough that if Proton did not come around the situation for Linux would be even worse, for gaming that is. But there are still issues and things that can be better on the platform. EAC and other anticheats are still obstructing many games, many popular ones from working. So how anyone can assess Proton's influence on promoting Linux, when it's still lacking, boggles my mind. There are other issues as well such as bugs. The more robust DXVK and Wine becomes the more powerful Proton will be.

Here are the things I think should happen, and I find it realistic expectations, for helping Linux:

• DXVK and WINE becoming more robust
• VKD3D rising up
• EAC or/and other Anti cheat working. Alternatively Valve's own anti cheat trust matchmaking, which they said they would upgrade (still no news on that)
• Vulkan adoption increasing (Stadia)
• Valve (and gamers) marketing Linux. But first Proton needs to be complete. A complete Proton will run games even with EAC or/and BattleEye and at least DXVK will be as performing as solid as possible. Ideally VKD3D having reached a milestone too (but still WIP)

One way they could market Linux is by involving developers with Proton by taking lower cut from games which become Proton conformant. Vulkan renderer would be at the top of the list of what said games need to be conformant.

EDIT: We will also need Feral and other reputable companies in our space to continue to provide native ports too. Goes without saying their work is also important.

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Quoting: Guest

Quoting: Whitewolfe80Well yes but if you now buy sandstorm are you not vindicating that decision see the linux guys bought it anyway and didnt cost us a dime.

This is EXACTLY my point. Why would any company that sees that Linux users are willing to pay for a Windows game ever make an effort to create a Linux-native version? Heck, if I were a business owner, even I would do the same thing; create only a Windows port, and get the Linux users 'for free'. I just don't see the incentive for any other action. Never have, really.

Except Insurgency Sandstorm does not work through Proton because of EAC. So for this particular case, making the claim that the developers are being lazy is completely void. I don't get what's so hard to understand. Many games, particularly major ones, are not profitable or yields little compared to developing new content for Windows. As consequent of that the developers drop support. Many developers probably aren't even aware of Proton, WINE or Linux (japanese devs I imagine). Many have already made up their mind and will NEVER make their game available for Linux regardless of any petition or outcry for support. I don't see anything nefarious with Focus Home Interactive omiting Linux (and MAC) support to focus on the game and more profitable consoles.

If any complaint I have it is that developers should help out with running games through WINE. For example if there is something in their source code that is important to know for WINE and DXVK devs, they should be nice and provide it with a agreement they won't disclose it to others. Or maybe they can give back some money to Linux users who decide to play a Windows game through Proton. Suppose the game costs $60: You buy and play the game (on Linux) til you no longer are able to refund it, you then receive $10 or $10 of wallet back.

Quoting: EikeThe trouble with both tactics, "No Tux, no bucks!" for more native games as well as Proton for more Linux gamers is that they didn't work. We tried the former one for years, and Linux ports were on a decline lately, then Proton arrived over a year ago, and the number of Linux gamers didn't rise.

I don't see any problem with any of the tactics. If you are able to and like a game that's developed for Linux, your purchase will be a win for Linux. With Proton you are forgetting some things. First, the project isn't complete. One of biggest missing puzzle to be solved is anti cheat. If that is solved many major online games such as FortNite, Apex Legends, PUBG, etc will work or be easier to work around. These are games that many people would switch over for. Lastly, it will take more than a year or two for Proton to increase number of Linux gamers. But one thing is certain, it has helped retain users and convince X people to switch to Linux. For any compatiblity layer, starting at 1% marketshare and trying to make it 5% by itself will be like a slow and difficult task. And it can and will be disrupted by ChromeOs (Stadia) and Windows (Xbox Game Pass and XCloud). So while Linux is starting to become feasible thanks to Proton, other platforms are also on the rise and making it harder to persuade people to switch.

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