Quoting: GuestYou're a fan of us not being given support for running a game on our OS like everyone else gets? Great, thanks for that, and for encouraging Windows gaming. Now those of us who support native releases with real Linux support, and those like you paying for Windows games with no Linux support, can all be 2nd class gamers together! <3

Show some respect? He never stated what you claim he has. We all want a game to be properly developed for Linux. If we didn't why would we be using Linux? There are so many games that I've not been able to play because developers never support the platform. And it has been said a million times, we don't have the userbase to justify major games (Call of Duty, Horizon Zero Dawn, Resident Evil to name a few) be developed for us as well.
Even if numbers were enough to turn a small profit...developing new content for Windows most likely gives more.

So if you think it is right for you to demand Focus Home Interactive to provide a Linux support (and continue doing so) I think you come off as entitled. I believe you are a passionate about Linux, but right now is not a point in time that we can demand things. Unless of course Focus Home Interactive has given a iron clad promise to provide Linux port. Assuming they have not done such thing, at most we should hope for the developers to get involved with Proton. If Proton stays consistent and makes more games available to us, hopefully anti cheat issue will be resolved, then most likely a glorious day will come where we will have adequate enough users to demand. But that day is not today.

Quoting: subI have technically the highest respect for Proton and the like.
Yet, I see it as big problem for native Linux gaming and danger for AAA Linux gaming as a whole.
What if we will see a new Direct3D or similar API which will be widely adopted
and no old renderer is supported by most devs?
Now imagine this new API is - for whatever reason (maybe by intention) - extremely hard to reverse engineer and map to Vulkan/OpenGL? Hence, a well supported Proton/WINE layer is not available or will take years until it barely runs.

Proton not only helps games work on Linux but also improves upon Linux ecosystem in small ways AND promotes Vulkan. From Proton post (FAQ):

Q: I'm a developer; I wasn't planning on targeting Linux, how can I best leverage the new Steam Play?

We recommend you target Vulkan natively in order to offer the best possible performance on all platforms, or at least offer it as an option if possible. It's also a good idea to avoid any invasive third-party DRM middleware, as they sometimes prevent compatibility features from working as intended.

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Quoting: rustybroomhandleTo recap the master goals:
- nobody installs software any more, it's all cloud
- most consumers will not use PCs, but closed appliances
- PC gaming in its current form dies

Will any of this happen as planned? Maybe, maybe not. But even Valve is preparing for this possibility.

That's some of my concerns that makes against Stadia or streaming in general depending on who is behind it. I am pretty certain both Microsoft and Google would love to make streaming only option to play games if they could (Xbox One backpedal). With Valve I am in doubt, I think they would give users the choice to have local and streaming.

Further elaboration but off topic

Spoiler, click me

It's frustrating to read people gloat about Stadia being so good and those against it are somehow dumb. Example is the circle post of "No downloads, just right into game". Yes, but good connection scales to downloading as well. Have that and you will spend less time waiting. Many people have good reasons for why Stadia is not good thing. They, Stadia supporters who gloat, are perfectly willing to exchange their control of their games or/and software and seemingly ignorant of the implications it has not for PC in general but to other people who would rather enjoy games locally.

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Quoting: orochi_kyoSince Valve locked the only HL official game in 10 years behind really expensive hardware, both PC and VR headset (first world kids speaks about 200$ headsets on Craiglist, Amazon and Ebay, so sad the rest of the world outside of US have to pay taxes and shipping), this is a good chance of Stadia to shine, Stadia offers PC gamers the chance of playing the latest games on any crappy PC, with a crappy keyboard and mouse or controller.

I think you are being unfair to Valve. It seems like they have production issues, and that's partially why it costs so much for Index. For Half Life, they stated in interview that scaling Half Life Alyx down to flat screens would be very hard and risk watering down the unique experience they created with VR. I don't think they were lying and using VR to sell Index. They also stated the thought of making Half Life 3 was very daunting and they started Half Life Alyx first as a VR experiment and second as a Half Life game. It absolutely sucks though. This has been the first time I've wanted to play VR and I can't afford. It looks really good.

On the topic: This is more or less what I expected. I would be supporting Stadia 100% if it wasn't for the fact I am convinced it will lead to a future where streaming overtakes other ways to play games i.e reducing choices. You can already see the bad signs of it already, we've had EGS with exclusivity and now Stadia has one exclusive game too. And that's just the tip of the ice berg of the implications I believe Stadia will have. Call me cynical or whatever but I know from experience where these things go...

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Stadia can be summed up with this quote:
MacOS User: What did it cost to play games on Linux?
Linux user: Everything

Also the whole "We are not the target audience and it will not affect PC platform" is a load of rubbish. Gylt, a third party game, is already exclusive to Stadia, and you are naive if you think Google would not love to burn regular way to play games to the ground and build more Stadias on top of them. It may not happen in five years or ten, but I'd wager that will be the end goal.

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Does Remote Play Together work through Proton?

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Quoting: YoRHa-2B

Quoting: LinuxwarperDo you think that it will be easier to get closer to Windows performance with VKD3D for DX12 games than with DXVK and DX11 games? Considering the similarities DX12 and Vulkan share and the opposite for DX11 and Vulkan.

Believe it or not, but mapping D3D12 to Vulkan is harder than D3D11. Yes, the APIs are similar in concept, but there are many little details which make it rather painful and introduce overhead in vkd3d. D3D11 might need more code, but it's fairly straight-forward for the most part since its abstractions are higher-level.

That said, in games where D3D12 is significantly better than D3D11, you'll find that vkd3d beats dxvk by a fair margin as well, so it's by no means slow, but there are quite a few nasty issues to sort out.

Is it primarily harder because there aren't solutions in place or because the way D3D12 works? Like if Vulkan were to have feature parity with D3D12, if that's right way to put it, would that make mapping to Vulkan easier?

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Quoting: YoRHa-2BWhile there's truth to that, we're really looking at getting as close to parity as possible, and just 70% of Windows performance is pretty bad to be perfectly honest. Especially when most games get ≥85% these days, at least on AMD GPUs.

Do you think that it will be easier to get closer to Windows performance with VKD3D for DX12 games than with DXVK and DX11 games? Considering the similarities DX12 and Vulkan share and the opposite for DX11 and Vulkan.

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I am convinced it will be adequate to good experience. The worries I have is implications Stadia's rise will have for gaming as a whole. I imagine we will see games being exclusive to Stadia, further tarnishing PC landscape (Epic). And not only just a exclusivity to Stadia market but possibly another kind of exclusivity: streaming only.
There are many other issues too, such as Google not being fair to developers by rejecting or burying their games because they don't have the "right" political view. Or that their game is "problematic".

The only positives I see is Vulkan being adopted more and Stadia making it harder for EGS to be successful. Hopefully it will also help with Linux ecosystem in general more than it will hurt us. I mean if Google really cared about desktop Linux they could, at very least, encourage developers to also develop their games (local version) on Stadia for a distribution of their choice: either Debian or Ubuntu. I won't hold my breath, that's wishful thinking. They seem like the type to use Linux primarily for their own gain.

Quoting: chancho_zombieeveryone is so eager to see all the negatives. I think that we owe a lot to google for making the modern internet what it is, we wouldn't have android, and lot of tech advances. I don't see google as a negative monopoly in this case it is a positive monopoly if they were that evil, they would work with the Chinese government to control everything because that would be their wet dream right?
I said this before I'm not afraid of companies controlling your data, governments controlling the data that´s worrisome.

Correct me if I'm wrong but has Google not benefited from technologies that FOSS developers have made? Furthermore is it not part of their development process to make their projects open source partially because this will allow developers outside their company to chip in and help the development? So why should FOSS enthusiasts be grateful for them when it seems their actions are largely motivated by their own self interest?

As for a company or government controlling information it should be quite clear that Google does that.

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Anticheat working with Proton will be the next big thing. As much as I want Linux ecosystem to grow, I really can't justify the expectation of a linux port. It may not popular opinion but developers can probably make more money instead of supporting Linux. FURTHERMORE many of the supposedly native Linux ports are lacking. What good is the game running on Linux if it's not properly developed and optimized for the platform?
Proton is as far as I see it a great solution for developers who have modest interest in Linux but can't justify supporting the platform.

And in chosing Vulkan to ensure the game complies with Proton, indirectly it will pave the way for a future where crossplatform software are used. This will inevitably lead to native ports for all platforms and the optimization will be largely the same for them. The way I see it the important issues for Linux gaming, at this point in time with our 1% marketshare, isn't native support but anticheat working with Proton or/and Proton being further polished (D9VK maturing more for example).

Quoting: Whitewolfe80It is interesting how accepting/resigned to the fact that proton is the best way to game on linux these days. When it first came out many said as long as native ports dont suffer well lets be brutally honest if its not from Feral vp or nightdrive its not coming natively to linux. Proton is the reality of linux gaming dont get me wrong am not down on it think its a great investment by valve and a sensible business decision vs windows and Epic store. But back to my original point we kind of all got to the point of meh what you going to do very quickly.

The reason for this makes perfect sense. Linux has 1% marketshare. In my opinion, with some exceptions, making a Linux port is not worth it. Because of that I am content playing games through Proton as long as it runs well.
But if ever the time comes where Linux gains 10% marketshare, I will no longer be happy with Proton and demand native port. Because at that point developers will have little to no excuse for doing a native release, and I will consider it a big negative if developers rely on Proton.

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Happy Birthday :) Although I didn't know saiyans celebrated birthdays

Such a good release. This part caught my eye the most:

Many Wine modules are now built as Windows PE files instead of Linux libraries. As work in this area progresses, this will eventually help some DRM and anti-cheat systems. If you build Proton locally, you will likely need to re-create the Vagrant VM to build PE files.

I wonder if the progress is in regards to EAC or/and Battleeye or anti cheat in general?

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