Quoting: dubigrasu

Quoting: Eike

Quoting: dubigrasu

The pitch for stadia, really the pitch for cloud gaming in general to me, if you wanna truly take off, is that is supposed to deliver gaming experiences that were otherwise impossible.
...................................
The point is: the killer app for cloud gaming was supposed to be gaming experiences that we couldn't otherwise achieve. That was the sales pitch.
And what Google needed to do is understand that it was going to take time and have some fucking patience for a change.

I don't think that's the main selling point for most people. That would be, IMHO, that you "rent" decent hardware instead of buying it and can play e.g. on your mediocre home office box.

True point, people can still merrily use Stadia and not give a second thought to the "cloud gaming" as envisioned and promised by Google, just like they can do on any other streaming service.

But while "true cloud-gaming" might not be seen as a selling point now, it could have been a strong one in the future, one that could truly make a difference in the way we see, play and think about games. One that could really differentiate Stadia from the rest. Killing SG&E though eliminated that from the future timeline.

And that's the thing, apart from some extra features, three's not much difference from the rest. They're now just another streaming service in the crowd, and some others, frankly, have better offers.
..........

Boy, I hate when I have to edit one single letter typo and then I have to carry that "last edited by etc etc" badge...

I don't know for sure out it fits the situation, but they launched Stadia State Share with Hitman 3... A title they didn't internally develop. Couldn't the same be done for other new features?

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Quoting: ugly

Quoting: Mohandevir

Quoting: Liam DaweEA just announced they're putting FIFA on Stadia in March. Interesting timing...

Yeah... But... Where is NHL21?! :cry::grin:

I used to play the NHL games. But buying them every year I started to realize how repetitive they got. I think the last one I have is NHL 2002. I haven't paid much attention to them in years. Last I heard the PC versions of the game didn't get the attention that the console versions got and were missing features. Is that still the case? Or do they even release the PC version anymore?

In fact, the last PC version is 2009. It's not even in 1080p. :grin:

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Quoting: slaapliedje

Quoting: Mohandevir

Quoting: Beamboom... seems I should give my Steam controller another chance, then. Try to figure out how on EARTH you can find it to actually be better than two analogue sticks :)

It's a sure thing that there is a learning curve, but when you get the hang of it, you can do a lot more stuff then what's permitted by a stick. Your trackpad settings and mine will probably differ, too... That's the beauty of the Steam Controller: fully configurable. You will have to find one that's a good fit for you. For my part, joystick as mouse or mouse are the two best preset options, depending on the game and I tweak them to my liking. Joystick emulation is utter garbage, imo, but somebody might have found a use case for some niche game too. :wink:

Edit: And don't base your gyroscope experience on the one in the Dualshock4... Quite a bad implementation, imo... It's always on and it gets in the way most of the time. The default behavior of the one in the Steam controller is activated when you touch (no need to press) the right trackpad. So, if you don't need it, it gets out of the way.

I found the same thing with the Switch's (or Switch pro), the gyroscope was more irritating than useful. I haven't really tried it with the Steam Controller.

Good to know... I couldn't speak for the Switch Pro controller (I don't have one). That's probably another advantage of the trackpad (touchpad)... I don't know how they could easily and naturally turn on and off the gyroscope with a stick... On the Steam controller, it's quite straightforward.

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Quoting: Linuxwarper

Quoting: MohandevirYou got valid theoretical points, but seriously... Come on guys... The end of PC gaming (or PC altogether) has been announced so many times, in the last 20 years... I'm not afraid in the least.

You should be worried at very least. Change takes time, and it won't happen so suddenly that you will notice it. IPhone sold 2.2 billion units according to wikipedia (Nov 1 2008). Back then there was less predatory practices on PC. The bad practices of microtransactions and lootboxes was more prevalent and bigger on mobile than they were on PC. I'd say the reason why is because many smartphone owners, many who were not gamers, did not have preexisting expectations of games and what should be in them as opposed to console and PC gamers. In less than a decade (aligning roughly with IPhone popularity) the sewer slowly leaked to PC platform and now the platform is a cesspool. In last 20 years streaming had not been as big of a thing as it is now and many of game companies were not as big and as independent as they are now.

... And, if ever it happens, which I highly doubt, yourself, will have abandonned the platform for something better and PC gaming will die in absolute indifference. That's usually how it happens.

Seriously, there are games that are just unfit for console use. I don't see that going anywhere soon. As long as there will be PC Gamers, there will be PC Gaming.

Streaming doesn't offer what a PC offers. It offers an alternative to consoles.

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You got valid theoretical points, but seriously... Come on guys... The end of PC gaming (or PC altogether) has been announced so many times, in the last 20 years... I'm not affraid in the least.

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: Linuxwarper

Quoting: EikeSupport costs for a huge variety of systems, compared to cloud servers or console systems.

Here we are on a site dedicated to gaming on Linux, hopeful that one day games will be natively released for the platform, and you raised the point that if developers decide to forego local releases entirely, which Stadia could lead to, then it would be because of support costs assosciated with supporting another platform. That means exclusion of support even for Windows, making it the entire PC platform. You just proved how Stadia can become a bad thing in the long run.

Yes, and I never said anything different. You said "there is no reason to not release game both locally and through cloud." There is! Variety of systems, hardware and software wise. I bought a single whitelisted Proton game and only Linux native games otherwise, but that doesn't mean I've got my eyes closed. There are - unfortunately - reasons why people/companies would not release games for Linux despite supporting Stadia. And yes, this is an additional threat for native PC gaming, and especially for native Linux gaming.

Yep, but PC gaming is a beast of it's own with sought out features that you can't find on any console. Any serious developper knows about that.

Microsoft tried to kill 32bit support... Remember? That was a much bigger threat to PC gaming than Stadia... Same logic applies.

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Quoting: Beamboom... seems I should give my Steam controller another chance, then. Try to figure out how on EARTH you can find it to actually be better than two analogue sticks :)

It's a sure thing that there is a learning curve, but when you get the hang of it, you can do a lot more stuff then what's permitted by a stick. Your trackpad settings and mine will probably differ, too... That's the beauty of the Steam Controller: fully configurable. You will have to find one that's a good fit for you. For my part, joystick as mouse or mouse are the two best preset options, depending on the game and I tweak them to my liking. Joystick emulation is utter garbage, imo, but somebody might have found a use case for some niche game too. :wink:

Edit: And don't base your gyroscope experience on the one in the Dualshock4... Quite a bad implementation, imo... It's always on and it gets in the way most of the time. The default behavior of the one in the Steam controller is activated when you touch (no need to press) the right trackpad. So, if you don't need it, it gets out of the way.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Linuxwarper

Quoting: EikeSupport costs for a huge variety of systems, compared to cloud servers or console systems.

Here we are on a site dedicated to gaming on Linux, hopeful that one day games will be natively released for the platform, and you raised the point that if developers decide to forego local releases entirely, which Stadia could lead to, then it would be because of support costs assosciated with supporting another platform. That means exclusion of support even for Windows, making it the entire PC platform. You just proved how Stadia can become a bad thing in the long run.

I'm pretty sure Eike meant hardware platform. PC as a platform has a wide variety of hardware configurations compared to consoles or dedicated servers, leading to higher support costs.

Exactly the same reason why cloud gaming won't kill PC gaming: consoles would have already done so, a while ago... And god did Microsoft tried! Remember, just before Valve launched Steam? Microsoft put all of it's weight on the Xbox telling everybody that PC gaming was a thing of the past and yet PC gaming is thriving. It's even stronger then ever before.

I'm quite sure that Stadia is in direct competition with the Playstation and the Xbox, not the PC. Google didn't call it "A console in the cloud" for no reason.

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Quoting: Beamboom

Quoting: MohandevirI still feel the exact opposite, even though I tried the Xbox one, PS4 and Nvidia Shield controllers. I always come back to my Steam Controller like old comfy slippers, even if I can admit that it's not perfect for all tasks, just like any controller, in fact.

Ah - so the Steam controller was your first controller? Then that may be the whole explanation right there. Habits are hard to get rid, so the first one get accustomed to usually sticks. :)

I mean, I really do DIG Valve's controller, love the looks, love the originality, love the build quality. But... Yeah. :(

Not even that. Let me think... My first one is the Coleco Intellivision... Atari 2600... NES... SNES... N64... Sega Mastersystem... Sega Genesis... original Playstation & Xbox... Then I jumped to Twin sticks on PC with a couple of Logitechs after that (even the one that had a recoiling usb cable). Thing is, the right stick always felt ineffective and incomplete, to me. I never could get used to it. Sorry to debunk your theory...

Steam Controller FTW! :tongue: :grin:

Quoting: dubigrasuI bought and used so many because I was never truly satisfied with them, like I was searching for something. And that thing turned out to be the Steam Controller, from the moment I got it in my hands I no longer had any use for the rest of them.

This! Exactly this! I even dropped controllers altogether for a while in favor of K+M. The Steam Controller is the reason I gave them a new shot.

Imo, The only thing that's missing, in the Steam controller, is true Android TV support, outside of the Steam Link app (Nvidia Shield). The default configuration is K+M which is quite limited.

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Quoting: randylThe contract between Valve and the publishers/developers may have clauses or stipulations which give an "MFN" status and that has to be determined during the hearing.

Aaaah! MFN is a term used to qualify a situation... They want to convince the court that some part of Valve's contract acts like a MFN. Is that so?

Edit: For the record... Don't know why I haven't tought about that in the first place:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Most_favoured_nation [External Link]

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