Great time for the "If you like series" @scaine

Haiku, Bloodstained and Rain World can be a bit of help on waiting for Silksong.

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Quoting: scaineI've just checked my list and I have around 12 of these articles currently planned out. Yep, they do take a while to do them justice, but when I find time, they're definitely getting written! Next one might be L4D2, but might be Hollow Knight... or something else. Not sure!

Thanks a lot for your article! and next one Hollow Knight, best game ever! :)

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Quoting: ZlopezI wonder if they fixed the issue with difficulty. In original game it was really frustrating then fun to play endgame. I don't mind difficult games, but this was mostly grinding new members for exp than anything else.

I read it is more difficult :/

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This seems a game very interesting for me. I will wait to exit early access and read the opinions.

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Nethack is very good, but very though, you need lot of knowledge and time. In the other hand Brogue is very nice and much more easy to get into and enjoy. In a long afternoon you can finish Brogue (after months of learning), but Nethack needs LOT more time to play and to learn. On the other hand there is people who know specific exploits to finish Nethack fast.

About Brogue,with the info: How to play and Tips, you're supposed to know enough.
https://sites.google.com/site/broguegame/?pli=1 [External Link]

And in Brogue you can know any monster fact just pressing a key, in the other hand on Nethack you need to look to tables of info on the monsters.

I played Brogue always without tiles, just it's beautiful ascii
Nethack I played using xnethack sometimes and later newt:
https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/File:Xnethack.png [External Link]
https://bitbucket.org/clivecrous/newt/src/master/ [External Link]

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Quoting: EikeNot sure if this will work out, but you might be interested to read:
https://www.pcgamer.com/the-japanese-pc-that-ran-the-original-metal-gear-is-coming-back-after-30-years-of-extinction/ [External Link]

Wow!

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: PenglingEe! :grin: I loved the first Metal Gear Solid and I strongly lean towards games with cute aesthetics, so this looks right up my alley.

I can recommend the original MSX-2 Metal Gear from 1987.

I still have the cartridge (and the MSX2+)

I played a lot! I am not sure that in the stealth genre is there something like the original Metal Gear!

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Quoting: zenorouge

Quoting: xaviThe classification of Roguelikes and Roguelites could take days, but for me the most important way to distinguish them is if the previous plays have significant help on the new play.

This way of distinguishing is a bit strange for someone who has played NetHack -- for most people roguelikeness is primarily a short-term gameplay genre (just like "platformer" or "first-person shooter"). So from your list, NetHack, Brogue and Sproggiwood are roguelikes (no matter the heavy meta in Sproggiwood and the bones in NetHack -- BTW other roguelikes with the bones feature do not have the curse problem), while others are not (Enter the Gungeon is a bullet hell, Rogue Legacy, Risk of Rain and Noita are platformers, FTL is... a genre of its own I guess).

This also happens to agree with what the developers of these games originally used -- Enter the Gungeon seems to say nothing, Rogue Legacy says "rogue-LITE", Risk of Rain says "with roguelike elements", FTL says "roguelike-like", Noita says "roguelite", Brogue and Sproggiwood say "roguelike", NetHack says nothing but the name "roguelike" itself has been coined precisely to group games like NetHack and Angband.

This is because this short-term gameplay genre has no other name, and also because it is gameplay what makes you want to play the game -- permadeath is fun only if you love the gameplay (note that most commercial roguelikes make permadeath an option for hardcore players).

Hello zenorouge, thanks for your comments.

In the past I've been a fan of http://www.roguelikeradio.com/ [External Link] and I've been learning enthusiastically on the topic and the different opinions.

Maybe there's no word for the type of games in my mind. That type of games should have permadeath and the improvement has to be based on your knowledge of the game and the skill (if it's more action oriented).

No win just with metaprogression like Vampire Survivors do. It is a funny game just to relax a bit, but the metaprogression/grindyness ruins it a bit.

Talking about FTL, when things get complicated, I pause a lot to manage everything. With the ability of command while pausing the level of action is similar to Nethack. Of course if FTL had a mode of blind pause (where you don't see and you cannot giver orders, ... a pause just for answer a phone call), then will be a different game, too much action oriented.

The way you explore in FTL, Noita, Risk of Rain is quite similar to the way you explore in Nethack. Having something that pressures you:
- fleet enemy advance on FTL
- more difficult final boss depending on how much "life containers" you find on Noita
- more difficult everytime as time passes on Risk of Rain
- more difficult levels depending on your character when you go down a floor on Nethack.

About permadeath, the Steel Soul mode of Hollow Knight is not enough because you can easily go to menu and then continue and you will be recovered on last bench.

So, yes, maybe I should not call them Roguelikes. Maybe what I like it's a compound of
- real permadeath
- win by improvement of knowledge (and skill), but not by previous games relevant metaprogression.
- about the pause... in many levels of Noita you go slow or can go step by step. Flying skills are important but most of the time you advance slow (like eg in DoomRL).

If it's a dungeon or a ship I don´t care. Variety is something nice, and by the way, if you don't know brogue or IVAN, they are great:
- https://sites.google.com/site/broguegame/ [External Link]
- https://attnam.com/ [External Link]

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The classification of Roguelikes and Roguelites could take days, but for me the most important way to distinguish them is if the previous plays have significant help on the new play. For example Rogue Legacy is an example where you win because you have more "powers" from previous plays. And in Roguelikes this adventage is minimum (in Nethack you may find bones of the previous plays, but you need to identify objects and they are cursed).

According to that:

As Roguelikes what I liked the most are Nethack, Brogue, FTL, Noita.

As Roguelites: Enter the Gungeon, Rogue Legacy, Sproggiwood, Risk of Rain.

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Quoting: Drakker

Quoting: xaviThe two Subset games have been cloned and published in same day!

https://subsetgames.com/ [External Link]

I was just about to post that too hehe. At the very least it shows how good their games are if people clone them outright.

You wanted to post this, but I have been faster than light ;)

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