Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: elmapulbut most of the time the changes arent trying to censor something for another audience that is bothered by this type of content

The SICs always makes this claim but is there any evidence what so ever that the devs made this change for "another audience" and not just because they themselves begun to feel uncomfortable with the original design?

i dont know what SIC means, but the staff changed completely afaik, the new staff have 0 respect for what came before then or the original target audience.

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy, and games make this amount of change and way more all the bloody time and nobody bitches. I put it to you that if they'd made exactly the same amount of change to add a few extra blood spatters and strategically tear one or two more garments, nobody here including you would be squalling about "But muh artistic integrity! But the exact art it had when I bought it!!!"

woke? i complain when that type of thing happen since the days of 4kids.
we paid for cable expecting to see animes (and other things) legally distributed and translated to our idiom.

what they did?
replaced the soundtrack (for inferior songs, but regardless of quality, that change the integrity of the animes), replaced the dialouges for inferior ones (again even if they "improved" something, we wanted the original, we didnt pay to be fooled), censored violence or sexually sugestive things (i can understand if the content was designed for kids, different countries have different definitions of what each can see, that is why we have CERO on japan, ESBR on europe and something else in the us, but as an adult i want the option to see the original and they dint provided it, not to mention that they adapted many shows to an younger audience than the originaly intended)

as they say, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.
i understand that games have updates that change content, but most of the time the changes arent trying to censor something for another audience that is bothered by this type of content.
no one purchase an porn magazine without the intetion of seen boobs, if your ebooks started removing porn they of course you'de be pissed.
sexually sugestive things are part of the reason why people purchase games like this, dead or alive and others, its quite different removing it than adding blood.

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Quoting: MetallinatusNo, we were talking about whether devs should reserve the right to change a product that a customer already paid for, as that is what you complained about.

for all intents and purposes... its the same thing in that case.

Quoting: MetallinatusAnd btw, fixing bugs is not always good for everyone either, in fact, it can be even worse than changing art, as it can *actually* affect the game for the worse. Ask any speedrunner if that isn't true.

i know, one more reason why consumers should have this right.
except for things like achievments, i think its fair for the developers to call "exploiting bugs" an cheat in their achievments system and remove achievments you got that way if proven, so long as they inform you beforehand.

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Quoting: EikeAccording to your logic - not mine.

Changing some sprites and backgrounds is very different from changing the genre or even the business model.

the question is: where you draw the line? what is acceptable for you might not be the same as what is acceptable for me, what define an piece of art for you might not be the same as what it define it for me.

an fighting game have tons of patches changing the balance (how much damage an attack does, how fast it is, the cool down,recover, range of the hitbox, timing) all of that can change, hell i played league of legends for a while they completely changed the gameplay of some characters!
an game can change a lot, and if its only there arent much we can do aobut it.

an video game is a lot of things, it is gameplay, sure, but its also soundtrack, graphics, every part of it matter.
one small change might not change an product but if we change a little bit for little bit in the end of the day we might end up with a completely different product, so again, where you draw the line?

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Quoting: slaapliedjeAs far as hating on removal of racist imagery making you a racist? What if it is important to the story line that you are taking out a band of racists, but some sensitivity editor decides that shouldn't be in the game, and now you're just killing a bunch of random people? :P

a good example of that is the series "everybody hate criss" wich have a bunch of racist jokes that are intended to show how absurd racism is, it make fun, mock how ridiculuous racism is all the time, yet it feature racism to show that.
should it be censored too?

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Quoting: MetallinatusYeah, people who bought Cyberpunk 2077 at release should just keep that version without a single patch, and if they want a new version they should just buy again, amirite?

art direction and bugs are 2 separate things, but yes.
are we really in a linux forum discussing if an consumer should have the rights to access an old version of an single player game if he dont like what changed in an patch?

we arent even talking about code here, but assets, i can understanf if an company changed a lot of things in a game (eg: the AI) but also fixed a lot of bugs, that they cant provide an version with the old ai system for those who dont like the new one, but with the bugs from the older version, fixed, im not asking for that.
but its that hard to not remove features, or assets or change assets without providing an option for those who dont like the new art direction? or what if the player rather deal with the old bugs than the new version of the game, in a single player match? whats wrong with that? why the consumer shouldnt have this right?
linux should be about freedom yet in a linux forum/discussion we are deffending that the companies should be able to do whatever THEY want with the product we paid for and supposedly OWN?

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Quoting: Eike

Quoting: melkemindThe reality is that people who are actually upset enough about this to actually review bomb are likely white supremacists themselves, even if they're too cowardly to admit it.

Also, it's telling that they'd get upset over the removal of sexual exploitation of young characters. It's not like they removed all sexy outfits or anything, only predatory depictions of young characters. Why would that bother someone unless they get off on exploiting young girls?

Lastly, there really is no justification for hating the removal of racist imagery unless you're racist yourself. People these days are really good at telling on themselves.

I always got this little hope that some people will scream at anything taken away, because, you know, free speech/art (without realizing that these rights absolutely include the right of the developers to change their art). But, yes, probably it's culture wars again.

if you paid for a piece of art, you want that piece of art, not something else.
whats next? you will purchase halo and microsoft will give you forza instead but you cant complain?

the artist can do whatever he want with new pieces of art, its his art afterall, but for things you already purchased?
what if companies start makting their games pay to win? oh wait, they are already doing it, and we should acept because its their art according to your logic.

what if an company decide to change an story you like into something else you dont, and you cant access the original anymore?
or an music? movie?

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Quoting: PatrickHogan

Quoting: elmapulimagine having bad people being portrayed as bad people...
that was a stupid move too.

It is where it's a hard part to judge, I mean I fully agree it's obviously a huge difference to make bad guys nazi's vs having nazi's that aren't immediately vilified. Though I suppose I also see the reason is the difference in timeline context. IE when people viewed Nazi's as a distant past evil, versus possibly triggering PTSD in people who are still alive and have been harrased by present day Nazi's.

I never will diss someone for just including nazi's as a bad guy, but it is worth noting there's a completely different result when a game uses fictional big bad organizations, versus using ones that are actually real and may in fact be a large part of the current players lives.

can't we simply put an "tigger warning" and an OPTION to not display such simbols? then we have both versions of the game avaliable, local multiplayer will prioritize the most sensitive person playing, online multiplayer each player see they own settings.
comeptitions like EVO might simply use the "safe version" the only issue would be streamers, but still there are countless hours of school girls content already uploaded over the internet so changing that now wont do much about it.

the same goes for people who dont like to see sexy outfits, instead of completely removing then, why not add an option to turn off fanservice?
even better, if the game feature sexual "fanservice" for both male and female characters, we might give the player the option to enable/disable this for each gender.
so straight man can have their sexy woman, gay man their sexy man, straight woman their sexy man, lesbians their sexy woman, bisexual or people who dont bother both.
hell there are a lot of straight woman who like to play with sexy female characters.

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Quoting: hardpenguin

removing Nazi-like depictions including armbands and symbols, adjusting some character artwork to remove sexualization of younger characters and racial stereotype issues

Good. To hell with nazis. Although I wouldn't say they did good job to remove sexualization of any characters.

imagine having bad people being portrayed as bad people...
that was a stupid move too.

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if you see the reviews there isnt just people giving negative scores, but also people being ironically positive, i found at least one comment like that:

"Thanks for removing a few of the character colors I didn't like, Hopefully you can remove the rest of the game in the next update. "
^yet the person recomend it lol

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