Yes! I've been following the PR on Github after they mentioned they're working on it. I wasn't expecting it this soon, but this is amazing.

GOG is finally an option I can consider now, since Cloud Save is one of my primary factors to buy instead of pirate- they've been slowly becoming a "backup plan" to Steam for VNs and have uncensored releases, so I've been wanting for them to have good experience for me. And Epic Overlay solves the issue that made people had to do some workarounds with compatible games.

Now that that's a major milestone crossed, I think we might soon see Heroic's plan to expand to other stores. Itch, Ubisoft, and EA Origins maybe? Maybe Battle.net, Minecraft, FFXIV, and Riot games as well? They've just been solid experiences that I prefer them over Bottles and Lutris.

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I don't care what they said in the past - businesses aren't the only ones capable of looking the other way when it fits their agenda - people kept saying that the problem for Linux adoptions are the lack of devices pre-installed with them and this is yet another step in that ladder. I want to see more of them.

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Quoting: Liam Dawe

Quoting: fenglengshunHi, while this is quite interesting, perhaps for the next lists we could also add a column for their ProtonDB rating? As someone who can't purchase the Deck, it would still be nice to keep track a comparison of the Deck Verification ratings and the ProtonDB ratings.

On it. Edit: done.

Thank you! That's actually pretty illuminating. Only Alyx is Silver, and that's a VR game (even if it has Native release) so that's not a surprise. A few "Playable" also have "Platinum" rating which is interesting - I'm not sure what Deep Rock can do about its texts, but DDLC I'm pretty sure could be tweaked to have an in-game keyboard if the creator is motivated enough (assuming he doesn't just support auto-invoke On-Screen Keyboard) and Tomb Rider is more of a 'willingness' issue with Launchers and stuff.

It's quite interesting to see that all of them has very good Proton ratings, and generally pretty good Deck ratings. I suppose if they're the type to get high ratings, they're also the type to listen to player requests and thus more likely to pay some attention to Linux support.

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as an accountant, every time i see a keyboard without numpad, i just feel so scared...

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Hi, while this is quite interesting, perhaps for the next lists we could also add a column for their ProtonDB rating? As someone who can't purchase the Deck, it would still be nice to keep track a comparison of the Deck Verification ratings and the ProtonDB ratings.

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Quoting: denyasisIsn't that the point for Valve? It ties Linux to the Steam ecosystem garunteeing sales income.

You can still use Proton outside of Steam. Bottles outright support using Proton + Steam Runtime. Pretty sure Heroic does as well, and so does a few other runners. And there's also the Wine builds that clearly benefits from Proton, like Wine-GE and Wine-Tkg, which is used as base for other builds like Wine-Lutris and Bottle's Caffe.

What Steam is selling is pretty simple: the It Just Works experience on Linux, for both consumers and developers. For Linux as a platform, what it's offering is an integrated platform that can be used downstream as well (not just the Deck- we've seen their OS being used by other handheld PCs and I know at least two distributions based on SteamOS 3.0).

That's the crux of what Steam is doing. They're not just doing one thing, they're creating an integrated platform that developers can target without THAT much additional work, they created a hardware+software combo that is genuinely compelling to mainstream users even if they don't care about the ideas of Linux (which is what drive most of us to tolerate the hassles of Linux), and they even created a framework that other vendors can take to use for themselves.

The real genius is that they're all so integrated to it that it's more of a hassle to separate them all that it's much easier to just use Steam and what they put out. It's a strategy that's definitely born from the corpses of several failed projects, tuned to really appeal to everyone who hasn't already set in their mind about certain things (for example the "No Tux, No Bux" crowds as well as Tim "muh EGS" Sweeney).

It reminded me of Android and Chrome. Sure, you can separate a lot of Google stuff from it, but they appeal so much to people that at some point they become entrenched. Even Microsoft is basically doing the same with Game Pass. I think that's the only real way to grow and sustain a new platform these days.

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...god fucking dammit, I was actually one of the people who had their hopes up. You know what? Fine, if they don't want to support Linux, then open up the Cloud Save API so that Heroic, Lutris, and Mini Galaxy can easily access them. THAT is literally the one reason withholding me from buying games on GOG. I'm even willing to pay more (since they don't have regional pricing for my region) if it meant I could get the VNs I want and I could have Cloud Save to go with them!

Fuck GOG man. Until they open up Cloud Save, they're a no go for me, no matter how much I want to just buy Muramasa and Evenicle 2 (because, yes, they have that) from them.

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[quote=Guest]

Quoting: fenglengshunIs FF7R a GNU+Linux native game? No, it's a Windows game running via a compatibility layer.

It's a step by step. The last time they forced a Linux native was the Steam Machine, and that failed spectacularly. They needed to make Linux a viable target with enough marketshare, which means requiring softwares to work with it without adding work on the developer's side.

Proton is currently the best compromise that Valve has- and for any game using DirectX 12 and below, it works as a good stopgap to get enough people on-board to become a legitimate development target while other areas catch up. And I think it's working as even Epic has started to decide mention Linux compatibility.

Do you have a source on Valve requiring Windows release on their store though? As far as I can see, it's more of a developer thing, in that it really doesn't make sense to not release a Windows version if you want your game to be played by more than twelve people.

And no, Microsoft can't really buy Valve out, assuming they even want to which is important as they are a private company, without getting into an antitrust. They were already skirting the line with Activision, Valve would too risky for them and probably not that much benefit for them given that they'd rather push their Game Pass model which is rapidly gaining ground.

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Quoting: GuestAs the biggest seller of Windows games, remind me how exactly are Valve "getting away" from Microsoft?
Oh that's right, they're not.

???? The Steam Deck?????

Microsoft is trying to bundle everything into the Game Pass subscription, which pretty much creates an ecosystem where you just keep subscribed to Microsoft and spend most of your time with their amazing value.

The Steam Deck, on the other hand, is a platform that heavily incentivize remaining on Linux, by making a very convenient, fairly-economic, and flexible device that's also not very convenient for Windows use.

Steam Deck, on its own, is making Linux starting to be part of the consideration, to the point that even Square Enix mention it for their FF7R on Steam announcement. Ideally, that would create a loop leading more Linux releases, enough to at least be a big enough market that Steam and Linux doesn't lose to the combination of Game Pass, PS Plus, and Epic.

Before Steam Deck, there really was a good chance that they'd get rolled over by the combination of those three, and it would have been out of their hands. But now they have good long term hope, and most of their fate are reliant on things that they can control - which is their own development of the Deck as a platform.

That changes things considerably as even if everything else went wrong and Microsoft does shit that threaten Steam's viability as a platform for Windows games (a real possibility before Microsoft Store's failure, but now brought back as due to Game Pass), with Aya and OneXPlayer interest in SteamOS, they are looking to have a platform that they could keep selling games to.

They're happy to keep selling Windows games, mind you, but the problem is if there isn't anyone to sell them to or if the platform makes it less viable because Microsoft controls Windows and theorically could fuck with Steam if they manage to find a way to do so without major backlash (see: Game Pass).

So yeah, they now have a platform that they also own and control, without the horrendous amount of commitment that Canonical had to make and then fail at. If they're already making their own platform, why the fuck would they want to let themselves be fucked by Red Hat (see: CentOS and the insanity that legacy boot removal was even proposed) and Gnome team (see: literally everything that happened since Gnome 3). Sure, they might want to make their own DE later on, but not even system76 did that out of the gate and even Canonical failed, and if they aren't doing that, then KDE is the only sensible choice over using yet another Gnome fork that stagnates.

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Quoting: GuestAs for Valve, they should have developed their own gaming-centric DE as the Deck's desktop experience is dire at best.

Here's hoping they eventually re-base to Nobara, with their own DE.

Yeah, that's not happening. With the gargantuan mountain they're moving, they HAVE to work with partners or nothing will get done. Valve has a lot of resources to be sure, but they can't build everything on their own. Happened with Proton, and naturally happened with their DE as well.

Even system76 and Budgie leverages existing tech, but whereas they both get to focus on one thing at a time, Valve has to make sure that not only everything works perfectly for gaming and whatever else users might do with their device, they still need to move fast as well or the Chinese brands will eat into the market they've expanded.

Between GNOME and KDE to partner with, KDE is just a natural choice for them. GNOME devs are notoriously hard to work with, if you don't align with the same vision and goals as them. KDE on the other hand is pretty content with building on what they have without breaking user's usecase. Sometime's that's not elegantly done, but it's better than having a headache every other major GNOME releases (unless you don't personalize anything, which is dumb because you try giving Fedora to a total Windows-normie).

Also, Arch is a pretty sensible choice. They are literally building their own platform to get away from the existential threat that is Microsoft, why would they let themselves be beholden to another company? And Nobara is new, it's driven by an experienced dev, sure, but it's new, it doesn't have the same community size as Arch, and it's still mainly reliant on a single dev. Saying SteamOS should be based on Nobara is absurd.

The simple fact is that Valve is a company who has to ship actual products and they are not incumbents to the game - they have to take the pragmatic choices here. And I'd rather they do that and make results everyone can benefit from over pulling yet another Steam Machine/Controller/Link.

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